Michigan Court of Appeals Overturns Clio Decision

Gun in Holster
Gun in Holster
Michigan Coalition For Responsible Gun Owners
Michigan Coalition For Responsible Gun Owners

USA -(Ammoland.com)- This past week, the Michigan Court of Appeals overturned a favorable circuit court decision in Herman vs. Clio and upheld an unfavorable circuit court decision in MGO vs. Ann Arbor.

The court ruled in summary, “The issue presented is whether state law preempts Clio Area School District policies banning the possession of firearms in schools and at school-sponsored events. We hold that it does not, and reverse the judgment of the circuit court.”

In short, the decision reverses a long held understanding that concealed pistol license holders enjoy an exception to carry openly in public schools and that public schools are local units of government that are preempted from enacting their own firearms rules.

The liberal justices on the three person Court of Appeals were hostile to gun owners in questioning and issued their judgement in short order.

That judgement is being appealed to the Michigan Supreme Court where gun owners should get a friendlier reception due to a 5-2 conservative majority. The MCRGO Legal Foundation is expected to participate in the appeal.

You can read the full decision here.


About MCRGO:

The Michigan Coalition for Responsible Gun Owners is a non-profit, non-partisan organization. Formed from just eight people in 1996, we now have thousands of members and numerous affiliated clubs across the state. We’re growing larger and more effective every day.

Our mission statement is: “Promoting safe use and ownership of firearms through education, litigation, and legislation”

Visit their website for more information.

  • 34 thoughts on “Michigan Court of Appeals Overturns Clio Decision

    1. The state of the second amendment is sad at best. The basis for ALL law in the united States is the constitution it’s self and all related documents, ie the bill of rights. We as the OWNERS of our government have allowed it to be perverted for nefarious purposes by nefarious people. The constitution it’s self clearly states ANY law in contradiction (local, state OR federal) to the constitution is NO law at all. This being the case ANY law ANYWHERE in the United States restricting the ownership AND carrying of (arms) guns, knives, etc. are in DIRECT conflict with “shall NOT be infringed”. And ANYONE demanding “an exception”, say a concealed permit, ownership permit, ammunition restrictions ad nauseum, is a FRAUD and a liar. And anyone claiming the supreme court has the authority to “interpret”
      “shall NOT be infringed” is to mentally challenged and immature to participate in ANY adult conversation.

      1. Montie R
        Interesting exposition. It remains however that the courts are the interpreters of the law and the constitution, which could be good, bad or indifferent. Also, the people elected by the citizenry nominate and confirm judicial appointments or nominations. It appears that at least sometimes, these nominations and confirmations might be less than wisely made, which again at least appears to return to the choices made by the voters.

      2. @Montie, The constitution does not state, “… ANY law in contradiction (local, state OR federal) to the constitution is NO law at all.” That would be Marbury v Madisen.
        @ Alan, Each branch of the federal government (executive, legislative, and judicial) are equal. Thus it does not remain to the courts as the sole interpreters of the constitution or federal law. The Judiciary wants us to believe that it is the final interpreter of the constitution and federal law, but that is merely a judicial fiction that the S Ct has been getting away with.

        1. Wild Bill:

          Point noted, which leads to the following question. Why one wonders does The Congress, given the equality of branches of government you and others have mentioned, seem to roll over and play dead to both t he Judiciary and Executive branches, as The Congress is not without significant powers, the power of the purse comes quickly to mind.

    2. Carrying a gun that is not cocked and locked could cost you your life. The precious time you spend racking a round into the chamber and cocking the gun gives the bad guy an advantage. He’s ready and you’re not. I prefer to be ready. A rapid draw my be necessary, but let’s leave the fast draw to McGraw and the old west movies.

    3. “The very purpose of a Bill of Rights was to withdraw certain subjects from the vicissitudes of political controversy, to place them beyond the reach of majorities and officials and to establish them as legal principles to be applied by the courts. One’s right to life, liberty, and property, to free speech, a free press, freedom of worship and assembly, and other fundamental rights may not be submitted to vote; they depend on the outcome of no elections.”

      When Michigan joined the Union, it agreed that the US Constitution was the Supreme Law of the Land. The Second Amendment is part of the Constitution, which restricts government from infringing upon an existing right. Each official takes an Oath to protect and defend the Constitution. It appears that these usurpers have violated their Oaths and have lost their qualified immunity from prosecution.

      I think open carry, in this society, is a foolish invitation to danger from criminals, police and misguided bureaucrats. Concealed carry is considerably more discreet. And the 1911 on safety notch might (just guessing) indicate an empty chamber, but the carrier’s desire to reduce the effort required to rack the slide.

    4. I read the article and also have read the responses and NO ONE is addressing the fact that these Commie/NWO/Liberals have completely destroyed the 2nd Amendment over the last 100 years! The 2nd Amendment is the LAW of the LAND and no Local or State Gov have the right to stop “We the People” from Arming and Carry our firearms anyplace we like! THAT’S THE LAW..!!! God help us, PLEASE!

      1. The Second amendment is standing strong or we would not be reading or posting comments on any of these forums. Yes the Peoples republic of the California have been severely crippled with no one to blame aside from the populace themselves. California surrendered the control of their schools and higher political offices to the left and now they are reaping what they sowed for themselves. I have a difficult time believing any true “Freedom” loving person still lives in that state. That state has been circling the drain for decades, sell it to mexico with all the socialist in it to boot.

        1. 4 Counties control all of California..LA County alone gave Hillary 2,464,364 votes, a mob controls California, funded by Hollywood..

          1. Right, we do have the same closed minded libs here in michigan too; our relief comes from being on the other side of the country from Hollywood, “Thank the God’s of mercy”. Still we have been fighting this war against the [democratic supporting] big labor unions. They still remain a threat; however as the unions have picketed and drove their livelihood and jobs out of state with their constant ‘labor strikes’ and demanding more and more for less and less. Now these once good generational jobs are in mexico and everywhere else but Michigan. Yes we still have some of the die hard labor union member whom credulously accepts everything the union bosses say just like a Hillary supporter with their nose up her ass, Nevertheless, their numbers are dwindling along with those once class A jobs. I suppose their is always sacrifice for liberty and freedom. If that means forfeiting once promising jobs to rid this state of left minded libs that have kept this state under the thumb of the giveaway democrats for years then so be it and good riddance to them. I could go on and on about this. I will end by telling you prisoners in the “Democratic Republic of California” that it has been decades that our state has suffered under the rule of the dems. it took catastrophic economic failure by the big three auto makers hear to break the back of the unions. It was not an event that was a planned strategy; it was their own greed that drove their continuation away. They bit the hand that feed them and when it bit back, the libs backed their bags and left for Texas and everywhere else their poison ideology was yet to infect. You folks over on the west side should have started your fight long long ago. PUt down the pot and other shit, “Surfs not up” TIME IS UP!!!

    5. why dont they put some pressure on their legislature and impeach those bums?..the 2nd specifically says people and shall not be infringed!!

    6. There is not now, just as there never was either room for or reason to compromise with the anti gun/anti gun rights/anti civil rights types in Michigan or anywhere else..

    7. No local law (home rule) should be permitted to legally dilute the Constitutional freedoms guaranteed by either the State Constitution or the Freedoms of the National Constitution. They are guaranteed freedoms signed by the States when they joined and formed the U.S. for all of the People! The only Constitutionally legal way to change those freedoms would be to rewrite the State Constitution or do the U.S. Constitutional Amendment passed by the majority of the States if done Nationally. That how I see it. And I believe that is how the Founders wanted it, to prevent easy dilution of freedoms by those adverse to our Constitutional Freedoms.

    8. PREEMPTION! The nature and mechanics of Michigan’s preemption law is what is at stake. Look: The Michigan Court of Appeals ruled that, “The issue presented is whether state law preempts Clio Area School District policies banning the possession of firearms in schools and at school-sponsored events. We hold that it does not, and reverse the judgment of the circuit court.” Those liberal bastards are eliminating the Michigan Legislature’s ability to protect gun owners!

        1. The argument made was that the school is a private entity and not a branch of government susceptible to the preemption law. That flies in the face of more than 100 years precedent and seems to have been wrongly decided by a biased court.

          Remember … the law strains at gnats and swallows camels whole. The judgment was made based on the “gnat” of whether the school district was a function of government or not and decided when the court agreed to “swallow the camel whole” that an organization wholly funded by real-estate taxes, whose customers are compelled to participate under threat of incarceration and whose principle administrators are elected by popular vote could somehow be a private corporation and thus able to control the presence of firearms on ‘their” property.

          This points to the dire necessity of an informed and engaged electorate when voting at any level.

        2. Are you even from you even from Michigan, these people in many of our courts treat there area as though they are totalitarian dictators. Come to Gladwin county on vacation and leave on probations is not just a sarcastic joke; these pricks write the law as they need it. This state would not know what an “ex post facto” lay was if it were kicking them in the ass. We live in the most bureaucratic state in the union. I live from California to Michigan and never have I found such a repressive State and local government anywhere else. If you like you can blame the big labor unions who have been in bed with the dem’s next to forever.

          Latin for “from a thing done afterward.” Ex post facto is most typically used to refer to a criminal law that applies retroactively, thereby criminalizing conduct that was legal when originally performed. Two clauses in the US Constitution prohibit ex post facto laws: Art 1, § 9 and Art.

    9. Let’s face it, that particular Court MAY have a legitimate issue, since this deals with OPEN CARRY. Teachers are notoriously fragile individuals, and often times they become near-comatose, when faced with the horrific image of a fierce weapon in open view. Remember, the current SCOTUS stands at eight members, and is evenly divided between Left and Right. That will soon change, once the New Trump Administration settles into position, and this is exactly the kind of case, the new Court will jump to reverse. (But, it will have NOTHING,WHATSOEVER, to do with the “proficiency of the students,” but it might well consider the unrealistic and unmitigated reaction of their teachers’ sensitivities.

      It is incumbent upon those of us who have no difficulty with such harmless visual images, to be patient enough to allow time for the new administration, along with a completely new DOJ, to an opportunity to change the academic environment from one of knee-jerk leftist “fear,” to one of a solid perception of “security.”

      1. Dan
        I agree 100% with your statement on ,
        being patient , Rome wasn’t built in a day !
        But it sure went up in smoke very fast !
        So to all Mi. ccw holders relax time is,
        on Our side now.

        1. With all due respect, I would argue that time is not on our side, and now is the time to be urgent regarding any push on furthering 2nd Amendment issues. We have, at worst, 2 years until another round of congressional elections, and only 4 years to attempt a repeat of this year’s results, not to mention all other state and local (re school board) elections. A mindset of having time on our side could lead to complacency on the part of too many people. Submitted with the utmost respect and thanks for your service and sacrifice.

          1. Agreed. There is NO ROOM FOR COMPLACENCY. The Dems will be pushing back, HARD, at the mid-terms even as we are trying to drain the swamp of RINOs and put conservatives in office.

      2. State law is state lw, and preempts local law. I’m convinnced MI’s Supreme COurt will reverse this, and settle the matter/ It COULD be considered an intra-state issue, and thus not amongst the types of matters Federal level courts can take up, even in appellate jurisdiction.

        Whether the case is about open carry or not, the deeper issue IS whether a local school district or school administration can enact rules more restrictive than what is prescribed in State law. Haven’t read MI’s preemption statues, but I’ll bet they’re pretty airtight. Rememver Seattle’s donnybrook when the high and mighty City Hooh hahs decided no one can carry in any public spaces in that liberal-infested dump. Washington state law clearly proscribes ANY lesser jurisdiction from enacting laws or rules more restrictive than state law. The first stupid Lord High Mayor of that silly city defended their little law, despite our AtG declaring in an opinion letter to the City that the law was illegal. He lost the next election, that being party why. Second Stupid Lord High Mayor continued the fight, sawing hundreds of thousands of tax dollars collected at gunpoint from the folks foolish enough to have elected him. Seattle LOST, big time, at every step of the way up to and including a ruling by the State Supreme Court. Injunctions early on stayed the enforcement of the law after the one individual with “standing” gained that status. A few of Mayor Chump Change Nickels’ signs remain installed, assiduopusly ignored by all knowledgeable Washingtonians. I am convinced Michigan’s story will be similar.

      3. Don’t adopt this mind set lest you end up like us here in Kalifornia. Clamp down hard and fast on the legislators when they try to take even a little bit of freedom when it comes to guns. My state certainly didn’t start with an all out ban on so-called assault weapons. They started slow, touting “safety” and “for the children” so that of the 10s of thousands of handguns available in the US, less than 800 are certified for sale in the state. Then it was open carry of pistols, then it was open carry of anything, then they ruled that “personal defense” is not good cause for a CCW in most large metro areas where CCW is a “won’t issue” if you’re not rich or connected. Then it was you don’t “need” magazines that hold more than 10 bullets. Now we have to get a permit to BUY ammo, plus get a background check at the point of purchase, which must be face to face, meaning no online ammo orders. And you have to register any AR type rifle with at least ONE of the features that make them evil and therefore “assault weapons”. And of course, they cannot be passed on to your kids on your death – they have to be removed from the state or turned in to the state.

        1. Seems to me that the law abiding gun owners had years of ample warning. What happened, I wonder. By the way, re this baloney about “safety” and “for the children” should have sounded alarm bells ringing loud enough to wake the dead. None of the above happened, so now the law abiding citizens of California are stuck with what their inattention rought them. By the way, I lived in California for about 3 years, late 1960’s and early 1970 prior to going overseas.

    10. Looking at the proficiency of the students on their tests, I can see why the school district might not want their parents carrying guns onto their school grounds.

    11. In the photo, the guy is carrying a 1911 in “Half-Cock”. It says in every manual I’ve ever read “DO NOT USE AS A CARRY OPTION” Its a safety mechanism if the Sear disengages. The only way to carry a loaded 1911 with one in the chamber is cocked and locked. Thank you.

      1. well then, lets hope he learns the importance of never walking around with a chambered round by putting a hole in his foot

      2. its also a serpa holster that everyone is now afraid now that Tex dumbass tries to blame for shooting himself. You cannot control another person’s decision when it comes to their approach to a firearm. Beside that, the dems are enough to stand against we do not have to nit pic each other on how or even if we do carry.

        If you shoot yourself in your leg because you were doing an unsafe quick draw that you did poorly enough to shoot your fat ass!!! thern post it on utube? Ya thats questionable and we will make fun of someone who post a self inflicted wound out of stupidity claiming it was a training video. OK if the message is don’t try and be a hot shot cool mr. Fast draw and send a bullet into your fat ass. Have not been to Clio for several years, don’t know if that pic is in front of the courthouse or not, it could could be something pulled off the web. I do agree that locked and cocked is better but I will carry my 1911’s cocked, uncocked, and sometimes I find it is half cocked for some reason like my coat catching it. The important issue is whether your holster covers and guards the trigger from access. It’s only an opinion.

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