By Dean Weingarten
Arizona -(Ammoland.com)- Constitutional Carry is gaining momentum in the states.
Kansas recently passed legislation making it the sixth state to have constitutional carry (where people who may legally own guns have the right to carry them openly or concealed). Mississippi passed a bill characterized as 90% constitutional carry, and a bill is pending in Maine that has majority support in the legislature, and likely support of the governor.
The South Carolina bill, H3025, recently passed the second read in the South Carolina House, 90-18. It still has to pass a third read, but amendments on the third read are required to be unanimous. From the facebook page of one of the legislators who authored the amendment:
Please join me in saying thank you to the 90 members of the South Carolina House of Representatives who today, by a vote of 90 to 18, gave second reading to the Clemmons, Yow, Hixon South Carolina Second Amendment Empowerment Act (H3025), with an amendment by Rep Mike Pitts and myself to authorize permitless concealed carry by every South Carolinian who can legally purchase a handgun! The bill, as now amended, allows SC CWP holders to carry in 27 states (instead of the current 20) Including GA and opens the door to recognizing every state's CWP. Additionally, the amendment authorizes every law abiding South Carolinian who can legally purchase a firearm, to carry it concealed without a permit! The bill awaits third reading in the House next Tuesday and then passes to the Senate for consideration. Thank you to every member of the SC House who supports the Second Amendment!
This is a permitless carry bill instead of a constitutional carry bill, because it would allow concealed carry without a permit, but not open carry. The bill also expands reciprocity to all other states' concealed carry permits. South Carolina is one of only six states that prohibit open carry. It is likely that Texas will be removed from that short list this year.
From the bill:
“(A) It is unlawful for anyone to carry about the person any handgun, whether concealed or not, except as follows, unless otherwise specifically prohibited by law: with the intent to use the handgun unlawfully against another person. The intent to use a handgun unlawfully against another person shall not be inferred from the mere possession, carrying, or concealment of the handgun, whether it is loaded or unloaded.
(B) No person shall carry a handgun off of any real property the person occupies as a resident, owner, or lessee if the person is under twenty-one years of age or carries the handgun in a manner that openly exposes it to common observation, with the following exceptions:
Governor Haley said that she would sign a constitutional carry bill, so she would presumably sign a partial reform such as this one. From a thestate.com:
COLUMBIA, SC — S.C. Gov. Nikki Haley said Tuesday that she backs a proposal that would make it legal for most South Carolinians to carry guns – concealed or in the open – without a permit or the training that the state currently requires.
It is unknown if the bill will be able to survive legislative gymnastics in the Senate. Constitutional carry has been introduced in previous years by State Senator Lee Bright, R-Spartanburg, but has been killed in committee, then, and this year, by Senator Larry Martin R-Pickens. By being passed in the house, it might be possible to circumvent the legislative power of Martin and his committee. It might not be necessary, as the bill does not allow open carry, which offends Senator Martin. From WLTX about the previous constitutional carry bill:
“You can carry a weapon openly if this bill is adopted and I'm offended by that,” said committee chair Sen. Larry Martin (R-Pickens).
If the bill goes to Martin's committee, and he strips out the permitless carry provision, and then passes the bill, it would go to the House for concurrence; if the House disagrees, then the bill could go to a conference committee. Members of the conference committee are appointed by the speaker of the House to a committee for the entire biennium. I do not know if the same applies to the Senate.
If the Senate insists upon its amendment, a message is sent to the House listing the names of three Senators appointed to a conference committee. The Speaker of the House then appoints three members of the House to a conference committee. The six members meet and try to reach an agreement. If they agree, their report is sent to both bodies for adoption.
This would allow the legislature to ‘work around' a recalcitrant committee chairman. That could happen if the leaders of the Senate and House both support the bill.
If the bill passes and is signed into law, it will create a new category of state; one where you do not need a permit to carry concealed, but are not allowed to carry openly.
Lets call it “Permitless Carry”
c2014 by Dean Weingarten: Permission to share is granted when this notice is included. Link to Gun Watch
About Dean Weingarten;
Dean Weingarten has been a peace officer, a military officer, was on the University of Wisconsin Pistol Team for four years, and was first certified to teach firearms safety in 1973. He taught the Arizona concealed carry course for fifteen years until the goal of constitutional carry was attained. He has degrees in meteorology and mining engineering, and recently retired from the Department of Defense after a 30 year career in Army Research, Development, Testing, and Evaluation.
UPDATE: 11/6/2015 From what we can see, the H. 3025 was referred to the Senate Judiciary Committee on 4/29/15 and to a subcommittee on 5/6/15, but saw no further action before the South Carolina legislature adjourned adjourned “sine die” (indefinitely). Not being familiar with the South Carolina legislature, we don't know whether they plan to convene in 2016 but, presuming not (which sine die would imply), the bill appears to be dead. ~ AmmoLand H/T GRNC
i am a cwp carrier, but i don’t support carrying without some amount of training. without it, how do you know where you can and can’t carry. i think you should be a legal us citizen with some safty traning on handling firearms.
Why is this still being posted around?
The Bill DIED last year.
AFAIK it has NOT been re-introduced in the 2016 session.
I like the simple identify method
MAY 05, 2015
Seriously? Why are you pushing a story that failed in the senate????
Riddle me that Batman…
THE BILL IS DEAD!!! WTF Over?
In mostly cases either the criminal will turn and run or be dispatched before the police arrive. It is a fallacy that the police will arrive to witness a shoot out. They rarely show up until it’s too late even for a gang shootout.
The “bill” is dead.
“UPDATE: 11/6/2015 From what we can see, the H. 3025 was referred to the Senate Judiciary Committee on 4/29/15 and to a subcommittee on 5/6/15, but saw no further action before the South Carolina legislature adjourned adjourned “sine die” (indefinitely). Not being familiar with the South Carolina legislature, we don’t know whether they plan to convene in 2016 but, presuming not (which sine die would imply), the bill appears to be dead. ~ AmmoLand H/T GRNC”
Then why in the hell did you post it again???
Seriously? Get mu damned hopes up and you pull this BS?
Posted on May 5, 2015 by Dean Weingarten
Are you managed by Disclose TV?
Okay, I’ve read enough to feel like I can chime in intelligently. I love concealed carry with the necessary classes and a permit. I am a concealed carrier. ALL THE TIME!!!!!!!!
I respect open carry with the same classes and same permits however, I will never open carry. If things go bad, the open carriers are the first targets. I want those few seconds to assess the situation, draw, and fire. Two to the chest and one to the head with complete confidence that I am hitting the criminals.
yet another ‘blank’ screen when attempting to share. thanks again, facebook.
@Nile; That is Facebook blocking any positive news about Guns and your gun rights. F-FB
I’m glad that only liberals drink and all conservatives are the salt of the earth now i know why the South lost the war Morons.
james,
Oklahoma allows licensees to carry – openly or concealed (I have my license, and obtaining it was a relatively simple process… which includes training). This state is “gun-friendly” and it’s system has so far been a fair and reasonable way to assure that citizens are indeed able to own and carry firearms, while ensuring general public safety.
With that said, I certainly admit that other states (Kansas, Wyoming, etc) have had no problems with permit-less carry or Constitutional Carry… primarily because most responsible citizens who decide to carry do get at least some training (integral part of the definition of “responsible”).
Sad that one man being offended by a constitutional right, can hold a whole citizenship at bay. Delusionally grandeur! A well armed society is a polite society. Keep going SC.
HAS THE BILL BEEN SIGNED
MY QUESTION IS THIS HAS HALEY SIGNED THE BILL! I HAVE MY CWP BUT IT EXPIRES IN A FEW MONTHS JUST NEED TO KNOW WHETHER I NEE TO RENEW IT OR NOT THANKS
Huge problems here. You are going to have people carrying guns who have no idea what the laws on protection are. Many will be shooting people just because they get pissed at them and think this is legal. This will only make gun owners look very bad. You have to know when the law says you can kill someone and when you can’t. These people will not have a clue and it will come back to bite all the good guys!!!
LMAO…. you people are so stupid. The gun crowd gets all upset over nothing because they think somebody is trying to take away their guns. The anti gun people get so upset because they think their streets are gonna turn into the OK Corral.
LISTEN TO ME….. THIS BILL HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH OPEN CARRY OR ANYBODY’S RIGHTS TO OWN A GUN. IT ONLY PERTAINS TO THE RECOGNITION BY S.C. OF ANOTHER STATE’S CONCEALED WEAPONS PERMIT.
HERE IS THE OFFICIAL LISTING OF THIS BILL:
H 3025 General Bill, By Clemmons, Yow, Hixon, Kennedy, Loftis, Huggins, Rivers, Hill, Gagnon, Stringer, Bedingfield, Burns, Hicks and Chumley
Summary: Concealed weapons permits
A BILL TO AMEND SECTION 23-31-215, AS AMENDED, CODE OF LAWS OF SOUTH CAROLINA, 1976, RELATING TO THE ISSUANCE OF CONCEALED WEAPONS PERMITS, SO AS TO REVISE THE CONDITIONS THAT ALLOW A HOLDER OF AN OUT-OF-STATE CONCEALED WEAPONS PERMIT TO CARRY A WEAPON IN THIS STATE.
It has nothing to do with open carry which is NOT allowed in this state. It has nothing to do with carry without permit, which is not allowed in this state. Geeze, people, know what you’re *itching about before you fly off the handle.
My rights were not “granted”, only guaranteed by the constitution. There is no TEST or PERMIT required to exercise any other protected right! Some will argue that no rights are absolute; ok. But, there must be a very high bar when determining who or what class of person should have their rights restricted. I do not need permission from any person or government and I am likewise responsible for my actions. Criminals must be held accountable for criminal activity and citizens are and should be free to live their lives how they see fit. The bottom line here is that you can do pretty much anything you want to provided you do not infringe on others’ rights to do the same. You do not have the right not to be offended. I don’t force my choices on others nor do I accept choices forced upon me.
I am a good guy with a gun and remain so until I prove to be a bad guy. Until then, you’re required by law to let me be. The 2nd Amendment says nothing about hunting or sporting purposes, and it’s necessary to have access to “like” weapons as may be employed against us by our government(s). I keep hearing that an AR15 is not suitable for personal defense, but that’s exactly what you will find in the trunk of most LEO’s vehicles. I’m fine with that! The 2nd Amendment was written not to protect us from each other; rather to protect all of us from government oppression. Those of us who carry protect all of us. Might want to leave us free to do so.
This is a simple situation to resolve. If you are a law abiding citizen of the USA , just go and get your CWP.
Why is this even a debate? Did they do away with the second amendment in SC and did not tell anyone. Wow if you can just disregard any amendment you do not like. Then surely you will not mind when they take away your 1st, 3rd and 4th amendment away right? I mean there are arguments on both sides of every amendment. So we just let an elected official who took an OATH to protect the constitution. ( And the bill of rights and the amendments). once taken, to chose which one they will follow? You know this may be old but, we need to quit repeating history. Hitler ordered all civilians to turn in their weapons. To reduce crime. Unless you belonged to the Nazi Party or SS. 6 million helpless and defenseless people died for that decision. Those Jews that survived now make sure that they will never be defenseless again. Only a government with a fear of its own citizens, would require them to be defenseless. And the 1st ones that should surrender their weapons.. Are the State Police and the secret service officers that protect the ones, who want your guns.
Ok i Believe in are 2ed Amendment right and i do Support the H.3025 Bill BUT i still think that instead of a Concealed Weapons Permit to carry That With this Bill (H.3025) that you should have to take a Handgun Safety Class before being able to Conceal Carry or Open Carry in SC
Lot’s of opinions here. Openly carrying a weapon is more likely to involve the carrier in a shooting incident. Please be ready and smart.
Martin is my senator and I have NEVER voted for that rino pos and never will. Pickes county is filed with backwoods rednecks who install Martin every time. My God! Pickens county people, WISE UP! WTH cares if something ‘offends’ Martin?
Just look at Chicago and Illinois the whole state as a prime example of a police state, all those gun laws and look at the crime rate. Things would not be like that if peoples constitutional rights are trampled on. PREAMBLE 2015… EDUCATION-EDUCATION
I think the law is a good idea. Remember all bad guys will have guns. Let’s even the odds and protect our homes , families , and if the unfortunate situation arises with a nut shooter , then take a stand and stop the nut from killing others. All you liberals against guns need to move somewhere else. How about Chicago , Detroit , NYC, etc. Go there where they have the ” toughest gun laws” , and the highest gun violence on earth !
Conservatives can live without Liberals quite well but Liberals must rely on Conservatives tl survive as Conservatives provide for their protection of freedom and sovereignty. Odd. isn’t it?
As a CWP holder in the great state of South Carolina, I fully support this bill. It’s an added bonus to further have a newly expanded reciprocity with other States. Personally, I will continue to renew my CWP for the simple fact that if I am forced to defend myself/family/property I will have proof of proper training on my side. Also I encourage education, which should be made readily available.
I am a CWP owner and I think it is a good idea to have a class and get some gun safety training for those wanting to carry a gun. A little knowledge is great and also it shows that you are willing to go get training to carry a gun. If they pass a law saying anyone that’s able to buy a gun carry a gun who and what knowledge of a gun will some and or most have. And how safe is that. I think a CWP class is great. I fell safer beside someone with a CWP than someone flasing a gun with no training cause SC said if you can buy a gun you can carry one. Nothing wrong with a little education. If all the people of SC want to carry concealed weapons go get a CWP.
The law should pass, an only for the those that are over 21. I think that you should be able to by a hunting gun at 18 it should be 21 as well. If your felon are have a bad rap on you shouldn’t have the rite to any kind of gun. But now days some of of the cops don’t care if your old enough or have a record they just turn there heads.
In mo opinion it is time for people to have the right to protect there selves I think if you want to carry a gun you should be able to and without a permit as this process only serves the purpose of someone making money off you for a right that is yours anyway
If a person can buy a hunting license you have to be legal ..do the same with a carry permit . Just like a wildlife officer checking hunting or fishing permits.
I have my cwp. I carry most of the time. I go to the shooting range. Some people need to learn how to shoot before they carry. I think if they are going to open carry or PermitLess carry the state needs to offer shooting lessons or classes. Or do like a safety course. To hunt is the state u have to pass a hunters safety course Do Something Like That. I honestly think u should have to pass a gun safety course to Own a gun.
We need our rites as law abiden citizens protected from political parties who are affraid of herting a want a be thugs momy who should have been a better parrent we all know when we got hour tells lit up we desearved it that wars wrong with the kids today no dissaplen or respect for others
We all know that if guns are illegal, all the criminals with guns will be the first to comply. Right? Don’t have a gun? Criminal shooting at you? Hurry! Call someone WITH a gun so they can arrive in time to identify your remains. Outlaws commit a lot less crime after someone shoots them.
I have been handling firearms of all types,hand guns,shot guns, rifle’s,auto and single action in both types pretty much all my life.I have NEVER pointed a gun at anyone with intentions of shooting anyone.I have hunted,and I have protected my family with them although there has NEVER been one instance where I have been in the situation to have to point a gun at any human being for any reason.I have met people in my drive with my 9mm in my pocket and told them after asking if there was a problem and then let them know that it was there for BOTH of our protection. In a couple of cases,the person on my property usually found themselves sitting on my porch drinking a glass of sweet tea or water while they chatted and waited on someone to come aid them with the problem they were having at the time.I have came across people that I had to sit back and watch them threaten another individual with a gun and not be able to assist the person being threatened by the person with a gun.It’s a horrible feeling,thinking that you’re fixing to see someone get killed right in front of you and there’s not a single thing you can do to stop it.NOW :, Had I had my gun on me,I could have helped that person and simply ask the perp if killing that person would be worth the price of his own life,letting him know that as SOON as he shot that person;, that I was going to shoot him.Now ,I can’t say what that person might have chosen to do,but I bet he would have had second thought’s about killing the person he was angry with at the moment.I think it would be an incredibly great law to allow decent citizen’s to carry permitless so the thugs out there would have the decision to ask themselves,if I threaten to shoot that person and try to shoot at them,are they gonna have a gun themselves and will they shoot me.This bill needs to be passed so that us law abiding citizens have at least a chance to defend ourselves rather than being herded sheep in a slaughter pen waiting for someone to decide it’s time to kill us.
All of you who believe in this bill and who wish it to pass, YOU must call, write, and VISIT your State Senators and make sure they understand where you stand on this bill. My first consideration in all elections from now on is where does the candidate stand on defending and preserving the Constitution! Our right and ability to protect self and family against criminals and tyranny are based in the second amendment. Without it, all others are at risk. Our representatives in the Carolina House seem to understand that, and we need to vote out the 18 who voted against our rights. We NOW need to provide a loud and clear mandate to the Senate and use the power of our votes to enforce our will. South Carolina is a precious gem, we are so lucky to live here! What happened to MARYLAND and NEW JERSEY is now happening to Virginia, and it can happen here as well! DO NOT sit silent and expect others to speak for you! You can start at this link: http://www.scstatehouse.gov/email.php?chamber=B
Lord help, I have sat here wasting my time reading all this back and forth poop. I have lived in South Carolina for 40 plus years. I have my conceal carry and I respect my hand gun. I take the time to shoot, clean and to be familiar with this gun. The way I see it is if you choose not to have a weapon then that is your choice as for me I would rather have the capability to at least have a say so in a situation if confronted with someone that has decided to bring a gun. I really do not believe that if this bill is passed that the great state of South Carolina will be a wild wild west show. I believe it probably won’t change things at all. The people that want guns will buy and carry and the ones that don’t will not purchase. I personally do like the idea of OPEN CARRY not so much for the sight but for the comfort and for the issue of keeping the weapon concealed. I don’t really know what the issue would be between open and concealed, that should be the owners decision. I think if I was a law officer I would rather be able to see a gun then to wonder if someone was hiding it. NO MATTER HOW YOU THINK, REMEMBER THE BAD GUYS WILL STILL HAVE GUNS AND THEY DO NOT CARE ABOUT YOUR LIFE OR YOUR FAMILYS!
Seems that everyone is worried about irresponsible, untrained citizens carrying a firearm, so my question to them is, do you think those outlaws out there who are carrying posess a ccp? And do you think they are responsible? The thing is, most of us here in SC, grew up shooting, hunting, and handling guns, most of us law abiding citizens could probably teach a gun safety class, now that said, I don’t have a problem with a requirement for citizens to take a safety course, its not a bad idea, because let’s face it there are some who would need it.but I think the state of South Carolina would be, over all, a safer place with law abiding citizens allowed to carry, openly, or conceiled. Class or no class.