Florida Agriculture Commissioner Abusing Her Position to Suspend 2A Rights

Democrat Nikki Fried Official Photo

USA – -(AmmoLand.com)- In a one-of-a-kind system unknown in other states, Florida’s wildly popular Concealed Weapon or Firearm Licensing program is overseen by the state’s Commissioner of Agriculture, in this case Nikki Fried.

Florida’s licensing division, which to date has issued more than 2.4 million CWFLs, is subordinate to Fried’s Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services. State lawmakers once flirted with the idea of taking the CWFL program away from Fried and transferring responsibility for the concealed-carry licenses to the Florida Department of Law Enforcement, but, ultimately, the changes were never made.

Fried is the only Democrat to hold statewide office in the Gunshine State, where last week Republican voters finally outnumbered registered Democrats. She is also the only state official known to possess both a CWFL and a Florida Medical Marijuana Card, regardless of the federal legal problems this creates when she purchases a firearm.

Now, Fried is using access to confidential gun-owner data that her position offers, in her campaign for governor against incumbent Gov. Ron DeSantis, and Fried has shrugged off scrutiny about her actions as well as attempts to gain clarity and accountability.

On July 27, at approximately 1:07 p.m., Fried tweeted: “I just suspended the concealed weapons permits of 22 people involved in the insurrection against the United States of America instigated by Donald Trump on January 6, 2021.”

Anti-gunners lauded her decision and her tweet.

“Thank you for being a real American. Those folks do not need to carry weapons,” one replied.

Gun owners saw it differently.

“So, you’ve stripped them of a constitutional right before they’ve even been convicted? I can’t wait until DeSantis destroys you because someone who abuses their position for political reasons should be in jail,” one replied.

State law allows Fried to suspend the CWFLs of licenses who are charged with certain crimes – usually felonies or misdemeanors involving domestic violence, which would prohibit someone from purchasing a firearm – until the final disposition of the case. However, not every crime qualifies. Several of the Jan. 6 attendees were charged with misdemeanors that would not prohibit a firearm purchase.

Fried’s 22 suspensions raised the question of whether she was taking legal action as the state official in charge of the CWFL program, or whether she grandstanding as part of her gubernatorial campaign.

Jacksonville attorney Eric Friday is general counsel for Florida Carry, Inc., a non-profit, non-partisan, grassroots organization dedicated to advancing the fundamental civil right of all Floridians to keep and bear arms for self-defense as guaranteed by the Second Amendment to the United States Constitution and Article I Section 8 of the Florida Constitution.

At the direction of the Florida Carry board of directors, on July 28 Friday sent Fried’s office a public records request, seeking:

“1. All notices of suspension of license or notice of intent to suspend, or any other communication sent to the 22 individuals by Commissioner of Agriculture Nikki Fried, or the Department of Agriculture, Division of Licensing as set forth in the Tweet by Commissioner Fried; 2. All charging documents or other information relied upon to suspend the 22 licensees identified in Commissioner Fried’s Tweet; 3. All information received from any law enforcement agency, a court, or the Florida Department of Law Enforcement regarding the 22 licensees and the arrests or charges which form the basis for the suspension of the license; and 4. Any subsequent written verification regarding the 22 licensees received by the Department of Agriculture from any law enforcement agency, a court, or the Florida Department of Law Enforcement.”

To be clear, Friday did not ask for the names or other identifying information of the 22 licensees whose CWFLs were suspended: “Because the individually identifying information such as name and address of the 22 licensees is protected from disclosure by law, this information may be redacted from any documents responsive to this request,” his request states.

Fried ignored the public records request, which is a violation of state law.

Last month, Fried announced she suspended the CWFLs of six more Jan. 6 attendees, whom she called “domestic terrorists” and “traitors.”

“Today I’m announcing the suspension of six licenses of domestic terrorists who participated in the January 6 insurrection attempt against the United States,” she said in an Oct. 19 tweet. “That brings our total to 28 suspensions. As more charges are filed, we will continue to hold these traitors accountable.”

In a written statement, Fried said:

“The storming of the Capitol on January 6th where we witnessed acts of violence and domestic terrorism intended to undermine our democratic institutions shook our nation to its core – and its impact continues to be felt every day. The individuals involved must be held accountable for their treasonous actions. While Florida has the shameful distinction of being home to the largest proportion of individuals charged in relation to the insurrection, our department has been using its lawful authority and carrying out its legal duty to suspend the licenses of anyone charged with disqualifying offenses. When we announced the initial 22 suspensions earlier this summer, we made it clear that this would be an ongoing effort and that additional suspensions and revocations would be issued as additional charges were filed and sentences rendered. Since that time, FDACS has suspended six additional licenses of individuals related to the insurrection, and should further charges and sentences come down, we will enact further suspensions and revocations of licenses issued by our department as required by Florida statute.”

Two days later, Fried’s department officially acknowledged that they received Friday’s public records request, which was sent approximately three months prior.

Dear Requester,

 Thank you for contacting the Florida Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services (the department). Please consider this response as acknowledgement of the department’s receipt of your public records request. … You are encouraged to frequently check the GovQA portal for updates, clarification requests or cost estimates (if applicable). To search for updates to your submitted request, click on the “My Request Center” link and then click “Search by Reference Number”.

 Sincerely,

 Florida Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services Public Records

407 South Calhoun Street

Tallahassee, FL 32399-0800

Fried did not return calls, emails, or messages left with her staff seeking comment for this story. To date, her department has not supplied any of the documents sought in Florida Carry’s public records request.

In an email sent Tuesday in response to a request to interview Fried, Erin M. Moffet, Fried’s Director of Strategic Communications & Federal Affairs, wrote:

“It is the Department’s position that providing the specific license types would lead to the disclosure of personally identifying information, which is required to remain confidential. Pursuant to Section 790.0601, Florida Statutes, FDACS can neither confirm nor deny whether an individual has ever applied for or received a concealed weapon or firearm license, as this information is exempt from disclosure as a public record.”

Moffett never addressed the intent of the original email – the request to interview Fried.

Sean Caranna is Florida Carry’s executive director and co-founder.

Said Caranna: “The reason that the licensing program was transferred to the Department of Agriculture years ago was to make sure that there would be an elected official who could be held responsible by the voters for abusing, misusing and failing to properly administer Florida’s first-of-its-kind shall-issue licensing program. Nikki Fried has just provided an important example of why that decision is still well-founded. She has mismanaged the program, infringed upon the people’s right to keep and bear arms, denied licenses without providing proof or evidence that people are disqualified, and now she uses secret information that is supposed to be confidential for her own political gains.”

This story is presented by the Second Amendment Foundation’s Investigative Journalism Project and wouldn’t be possible without you. Please click here to make a tax-deductible donation to support more pro-gun stories like this.


About Lee Williams

Lee Williams, who is also known as “The Gun Writer,” is the chief editor of the Second Amendment Foundation’s Investigative Journalism Project. Until recently, he was also an editor for a daily newspaper in Florida. Before becoming an editor, Lee was an investigative reporter at newspapers in three states and a U.S. Territory. Before becoming a journalist, he worked as a police officer. Before becoming a cop, Lee served in the Army. He’s earned more than a dozen national journalism awards as a reporter, and three medals of valor as a cop. Lee is an avid tactical shooter.

Lee Williams

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Brian

She shouldn’t be rescinding the civil rights of folks who have yet to be convicted of crimes that would warrant said suspension, and marijuana should be legal nationwide.

ExGob

If this old gal thinks her opinion about firearms possession and carry is going to enhance her chances of unseating DeSantis, she knows even less about politics than she does about the Constitution Of The United States Of America, which, obviously, is damn little. And the person who made the comment ‘those folks do not need to carry weapons’, knows even less. If agreeing with her thinking is what it takes to be a real American, damn few of us would qualify. The 2nd amendment to our Constitution makes no mention of a ‘need’ or a permit to possess and/or… Read more »

Lachesis

If it’s going to take over 24 hours to approve my comments while others have their comments are approved almost immediately then I have no interest in this account, reading or commenting on any future articles.

Wild Bill

Happens to everyone. Welcome aboard.

Glypto Dropem

My comments always seem to post instantly. Maybe it has to do with how old your account is?

Wild Bill

The chief scientist at Pfizer gives stark warning:

https://www.brighteon.com/0aedd76e-6be9-42c8-ae10-d6913f467ba8

USMC0351Grunt

Florida gave the position to the =Florida Department of Agriculture as THAT position is the only elected official with STATEWIDE authority do administer such actions.

Florida Agriculture Commissioner Abusing Her Position to Suspend 2A Rights – Concealed Patriot

Lachesis

It takes over 7 hours to approve a comment I made? I’m done with this site.

None

That C__t needs to be held accountable and jailed for taking her anti gun stance against these individuals who were never found guilty of a crime much less insurection for her political means, calling them traitors to me is enough to remove her permainently from any public office
Another anti gun Democrat dictator wanna be that should be run out of office
Can’t wait untill Govenor Desantis pounds her pathetic run for Govenor into a new mudhole.

Bubba

Time to impeach her.

Country Boy

so where’s the proof these 22 people committed a crime? Is just attending a republican/conservative political rally now a crime? Looks like it is according to socialist progressive marxist democrat communists.
This shit is gonna blow back on them at a level they cannot even imagine.

Fred

Commissioner Fried openly maintains a Florida concealed carry license and medical marijuana card simultaneously in violation of Florida law (FSS 790.06(2)( n ) and 790.06(10)(a)). She does this to her own personal and political benefit. She has been allowed to carry on with this blatant corruption without inquiry from the press nor investigation from any government agency. We live in interesting times.

wapitihunter

Jimmy, your exactly right! SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED to me means not only do you have the right to own them but you have the right to BEAR them. Doesn’t Bear mean to carry? Have the Demoncrap lawyers and criminal politicians changed the dictionary? NO SPECIAL Permits or Taxes. If every legal citizen could carry then the lawless would tread lightly. That scares the hell out of crooked, corrupt Politicians.

Wild Bill

You are one hundred per cent correct, sir! The language of the law has not changed. Bear means “To support, sustain, or carry. Please see Black’s Law Dictionary, Ed 5, p140
And shall, ” As used in statutes, contracts, or the like, this word generally imperative or mandatory.” Ibid, p1233

JimmyS

Handgun “licenses”….how do you reconcile that with the Constitution, exactly? Maybe it would help if you pulled you head out of your ass before trying to figure out a reply.

Wild Bill

Originally the entire Bill of Rights only limited the Federal government. The Fourteenth Amendment was intended to apply the entire BOR to the states, but the S. CT decided to incorporate each Amendment to the states as a case in controversy came up, and no one could force the S. CT to do otherwise. Finally the S. Ct found that the Right to Bear Arms is an individual Right of each adult citizen and permanent resident. Please see D.C.v. Heller. Then the S. Ct incorporated the Second Amendment against all the states in McDonald v. Chicago. Now, there should be… Read more »

JimmyS

Shall…not…be…infringed.

Traitors should get the noose in the public square, every time. I’ve no more patience for anti-liberty, anti-Constitutional, power-grabbing, criminals who imagine themselves better than the rest of us, and see themselves as above the laws to which they swore an oath.

Terry

She is obviously a fool and Communist. She should be removed from office for “overstep” .

what an ass

Grim

She’s on the list. Get a rope!

Wild Bill

Have rope. Will travel.

hoss

I’ve been reading comments on this, and other blogs blaming this person, that person, and different ideologies. I have a idea, lets call it what it is, communism! Until you accept what it is you’ll be a day late, and a dollar short when the CRBs take complete control. Don’t think it will happen? Look at Venezuelan

None

I don’t think they hung enough of them in Venezuela when they had the chance

Vern

I recently read an article that reported the “break in,” of the capital building happened while Trump was making his speech, all of those who have been charged with breaking into the capital building were still with Trump when the “break in,” happened. There seems to be something going on to spread lies, the democrats surely wouldn’t spread lies, would they?

USMC0351Grunt

Can you produce evidence to this? If so, HERE and NOW is the proper time!

Vern

It was in the Daily Signal and the Washington Beacon, i believe, I read so many articles some days when my wife is really having a bad day so I can be close by if she needs help. Other days I am outside or working.

Lachesis

DeSantis will do nothing about this. Too many think of DeSantis as some kind of savior, ignoring his track record when it comes to the 2A. He has refused to address and end the Red Flag laws in Florida, one of the most serious threats against our 2A freedoms. Where is he on Constitutional carry? Better wake up Floridians, he is not who you think he is.

hippybiker

Hey Tex. You worry about your State and we’ll worry about Florida!

Wild Bill

Ok, that is fair. We will work for freedom in Texas, and you work for freedom in Florida. Maybe you all will come up with a good solution that we had not thought of or maybe we will come up with something that would prove useful to Floridians.

Wild Bill

She strikes me as the kind of person that has to manipulate others or manipulate state. A kind of sneak.

Wild Bill

I am wondering if she is in an elected position so that the Governor can not remove her. Where are those Florida guys when a guy needs them?

swmft

it is elected position, but she can be removed.there are provisions in Florida statutes ,elections commissioners have been kicked out (broward county for one) hid two boxes of ballots from conservative area helped obummer

Wild Bill

Can Gov. DeSantis remove her?

Russn8r

Get off Abbott’s jock. He’s a VichyCon pretender. Only does the right thing under heavy pressure from real Rs, often not then. Tested the water for RED FLAG & AW bans.

https://www.dallasnews.com/news/politics/2020/02/03/texans-overwhelmingly-want-gun-background-checks-are-open-to-red-flag-laws-dmn-ut-tyler-poll-finds/

~Abbott suggested red-flag laws after 10 were killed in a 2018 school shooting, but later backed away from it.

Red Flag is opposed by Jack Wilson who returned fire at his church, and Stephen Willeford who confronted the gunman in a shooting that left 26 parishioners dead.

“If somebody wants a gun,” Wilson said, “they can get it whenever they want, red flag laws or not.”

Last edited 1 month ago by Russn8r
Russn8r

Get your chimp off Abbott’s jock, WB

https://www.dallasnews.com/news/politics/2019/08/22/could-texas-change-its-gun-laws-after-el-paso-mass-shooting-gov-abbott-opens-talks-as-nra-says-no-no-and-no/

Abbott expressed concerns about laws that allow private gun sales without background checks.

“One stranger can sell a gun to another stranger and that’s a danger,” said Abbott.”

“Assault weapons,” Abbott said, “there was no coalescence of any type of solution about where we go with that. But there were several strategies on the table we will continue to talk about.”

Russn8r

How Abbott Killed a Ban on Child Sex Change
https://texasscorecard.com/podcasts/how-burrows-phelan-abbott-killed-a-ban-on-sex-change-surgeries-in-texas-episode-140

Take $250k from sex-change mills
https://nationalfile.com/texas-abbott-patrick-house-speaker-received-250k-from-clinic-that-chemically-castrates-transgender-kids/

His lockdown killed 1000s of firms; won’t call special mandate session despite months-old EO being widely ignored.

“Fine with his ‘close small business’ EO jailing folks, does zip to enforce his EO on vax mandates.”

Only helped free Shelley Luther under pressure. 3 great primary challengers:
Dan Huffines
Allen West
Chad Prather

hippybiker

Nikki Fried. Just another worthless, Cant Understand Normal Thinker!

UncleT

When is DeSantis going to push Constitutional Carry for Florida so they can stop dealing with this traitor and others like her?

Wild Bill

You mean the leather holster company?

UncleT

???

Wild Bill

DeSantis the big leather holster company. It would make sense for that company to push Constitutional Carry for Florida.

Russn8r

Probably when corrupt Marion Hammer’s NRA stops backing “gun free” zones like Parkland & Pulse.

BTW, how many “gun free” zones were there in 1789 & 92 when the Constitution & 2A were adopted?

It’s not Constitutional Carry. It’s Permitless Carry where 2A is honored.

None

Agree permit less carry should be the law of the land

Russn8r

True Constitutional Carry should be the law of the land.

Montana454Casull

She is doing what a infringing Democrat does best infringing on people rights and ignoring her oath to uphold the constitution. Freedom starts without permits to carry a firearm a right granted by god not a privilege granted by this TWAT !

JPM

Another power hungry Democrat willing to piss on the Constitution and the residents of her state for her own personal agenda goals (money and power). She deserves a short rope and a long drop.

Mystic Wolf

Why not have her looking at the bottom of a basket while clamped to a bench, a split second of very intense pain then nothing.

Wild Bill

Too French.

Hazcat

Glad to see DiSantis is on top of this (/s). As usual he has no time for 2A matters.

john

The democratic position on firearms has alway been flawed as are most democrats. If she is carrying a weapon while high on marijuana she herself just might be breaking the law. I have always found it interesting that the federal government still list marijuana as illegal. Then itself the federal government collects taxes from medical marijuana dispensaries. Then will not letting federally insured banks receive deposits from medical marijuana dispensaries. Each state which allows dispensaries has over the years also has collected the tax revenue. Anyway maybe the democrats have adjusted that law ? one thing is for sure their… Read more »

USMC0351Grunt

They are getting away with “it” because of the outrageous number of apathetic citizens that find the slightest excuse to not sacrifice ANYTHING to move toward grand jury investigation(s) and indictments of corrupt elected and appointed officials. Most want to, “wait and vote them out of office.” That is unless you’re willing and volunteering to take part in forming a national coalition of citizens in each state to begin charging the corrupt elected and appointed officials and start removing them from office immediately by way of Grand Jury indictments?

Patriot Solutions

Defamation could be rewarding depending on circumstances. Those tweets could make millionaires.

Last edited 1 month ago by Patriot Solutions
USMC0351Grunt

Naaa… The law is pretty much like what the NICS background check system does to citizens. Unless you put forth the effort and fight the issue(s), nothing will happen. But the 28 DO have solutions, they just need to step-up to the plate and ap[ply them.

Attorney for Concealed Weapon Permit being Revoke, Suspended, Denied (criminaldefenseattorneytampa.com)

JSNMGC

TEX (“Will”) – 11/26/21

“It’s amazing that handgun licenses would ever be issued and regulated by the Agriculture Dept. in any state. Only the State Law Enforcement Agency should be responsible for that.”

Reply to TEX (“Will”):

Oh, hell no.

Many in law enforcement have proven over and over again they are too corrupt and/or too lazy to be trusted with this authority.

Eliminate licensing.

JSNMGC

TEX (“Will”) – 11/26/21: “I’m with you on eliminating licensing nationwide. But only LE should regulate licensing on states that still require it. Not the Agriculture Dept. You can obviously see what this led to in FL.” Reply to TEX (“Will”): I can see what giving law enforcement that authority has led to in other states. We are lucky enough to have at least two former CA enforcers posting within the last 24 hours. They could provide some links to what happened in CA. Plenty of examples in other states. Some enforcers can’t even be trusted to enforce tail light… Read more »

Last edited 1 month ago by JSNMGC
Wild Bill

No need to twist tails.

JSNMGC

There you go again with trying to selectively reprimand people. You did not reprimand TEX (“Will”) for his lack of civility (since your return) and for him lamenting not still being in law enforcement so he could abuse his authority against someone with whom he had political disagreements (it’s all out there and he referenced it since your return). Regarding the “twisting of tails,” a subset of law enforcement personnel abuse their power in different ways – some grant concealed carry permits only to those who have political power and their friends, and some drag their feet for unacceptably long… Read more »

Wild Bill

That is not a reprimand. You have mischaracterized my observation.

JSNMGC

Perhaps you are accustomed to people accepting your unequal, paternalistic observations.

I’m not one of those people.

Last edited 1 month ago by JSNMGC
Wild Bill

Paternalistic is another mischaracterization. The rest is a mere guess.

JSNMGC

No, it was an unequal, paternalistic attempt at a reprimand by making an “observation.” Some people get that way after years of people obeying them without question.

Wild Bill

Well, if you stick to the facts, and apply logic, then you won’t feel unequal.

JSNMGC

I don’t feel unequal – that was a pathetic attempt at a twist. I would be delighted to debate Will (“TEX”), or you, anytime. You, on the other hand, are unequal in your attempts to reprimand people. For example, recently: Will became emotional and used profanity; I quoted him before he deleted his post; Another poster criticized me because he was confused and didn’t understand it was Will who used profanity; and Then, Will jumped back in agreeing with the confused poster how disgraceful it was for me to use profanity. You pretend you don’t see this stuff and then… Read more »

JSNMGC

TEX (“Will”) – 11/26/21:

,the language you used the evening in question was a total disgrace. Just an absolute disgrace. You should be so ashamed! You always need to watch out for trees when you go skiing. Trees just don’t give much when you ski into them. It’s that Sonny Bono thing! Be so careful!!!!”

Reply to TEX (“Will”):

Just like enforcers who lie even when they know they are being video recorded by themselves and others, you just can’t help yourself.

Now you are hoping I die in a skiing accident.

That’s not nice.

JSNMGC

Here is what you wrote, TEX (“Will”):

Will (“TEX”) – 11/4/21:
“This is the last communication with you from me. I’m talking about “state” registration and you’re talking “feds” you F*UCKING idiot. Gov Abbott just got rid of most that NFA BULLSHIT IN TEXAS TOO. TEX TEXAS,LIKE A WHOLE OTHER COUNTRY!”

Then you wrote this:

Will (“TEX”) – 11/4/21:
“Laddyboy,you’re so right! He has a potty mouth and it’s a disgrace. A total disgrace.”

It’s still there for all to see:

https://www.ammoland.com/2021/11/rapid-city-sd-man-found-guilty-of-multiple-firearm-charges/#axzz7DN3PV9X5

JSNMGC

TEX – 11/26/21:

,I really hope you have an enjoyable and very safe trip when you go skiing. Take care.”

Reply to TEX:

Thank you.

Wild Bill

Perhaps you would prefer a maternalistic observation!

Russn8r

Why not. Don’t chimps have tails?

Mystic Wolf

No, they do not but monkeys do have a tail, all you need to do is check out pics of some chimpanzees to know that.

Russn8r

That was one o’them rhetorical questions.

Donttreadonme

Cant agree here. At most, County clerks without the assistance of LE should be responsible in places that still require permits. And for the record, permits are an infringement as its a system that has and still manipulates the system to deny citizens a fundamental right.

wapitihunter

Look like the Dept of AG isn’t any better. The Governor needs to get involved.

JSNMGC

There is only one AG, and she is fairly easy to remove from office and replace. I agree – the governor needs to get involved, but he is not particulary pro 2nd Amendment. There are thousands of enforcers in Florida. They are hard to terminate and replace. Enforcers just don’t have a good reputation for resisting the urge to abuse power. We have one who posts here who was fairly specific how he would retaliate against someone with whom he had different views on politics. It’s not unusual. Florida enforcers have abused their power many times by harrassing people who… Read more »

Last edited 1 month ago by JSNMGC
JSNMGC

A certain percentage (including Will/TEX/et al.) do bad things and then lie. They just can’t help themselves:

https://bearingarms.com/camedwards/2021/12/15/california-sheriff-indicted-in-concealed-carry-bribery-scandal-n53516

Last edited 1 month ago by JSNMGC
Russn8r

They also do bad things, try to cover their tracks & RUN AWAY

JSNMGC

Destroy evidence and have their pro bono lawyer make comments in an attempt to suggest the quote was fabricated or altered.

Wild Bill

I notice that when you, two, show up many others stop commenting. You all are throwing a wet blanket on many interesting conversations.

JSNMGC

Is that your observation?

I notice that Will/TEX/et al. lies and you try to cover for him. That’s something I notice.

Wild Bill

I am not the only one that has noticed.
What about that yarn about knowing a professor at a college that I attended, what a coincidence!!!

Russn8r

I doubt you went to Hamline. Prove it by naming yourself and everyone you supposedly knew there. Real names & dates, not sock-pup handles like TEX. Hemline maybe, Hamline no. I’ve requested this verifiable info before. Maybe you’re too busy milking bulls on your phantasy ranch.

Crickets Chirping…

Wild Bill

I provided the name of the universities in the first place. Who could make up the name of an obscure, midwestern university on such short notice.Yes, I was a Hamline Piper, no getting around that.
I think that it is your turn, unless, you have none, of course.

Last edited 1 month ago by Wild Bill
Oldman

You are totally on target with this WB. I find it boring listening to the girls in the sewing circle clucking like hens sitting on their eggs. YAWN!

JSNMGC

Oldman, would you rather read Will/TEX’s lies he uses to defend Brailsford? Or his lies about the use of profanity? Or him talking about how he would would give a months pay to “light me up?”

Wild Bill

That is a false choice. We would rather read the interesting comments generated by the interesting articles that the interesting authors of Ammoland have worked so hard to produce.

JSNMGC

You continue to use the appeal to a crowd:

“I am not the only one who has noticed.”

“We would rather . . .”

Wild Bill

Well, you could be appealing if you tried. Dump that vitriolic, self hating, six year old. We want to hear about you, your favorite gun, and your dog rather than what you have been writing about.

JSNMGC

“We?”

Wild Bill

That is it? That is all you got? All right. I’ll start you off:
“No Nativity Scene in Washington, DC This Year
 
The Supreme court has ruled that there cannot be a Nativity scene in the capital this Christmas season.
 
This isn’t for any religious reason and not because of any COVID related issues. No, they simply have not been able to find three wise men in the nation’s capital. A search for a virgin continues… There was no problem, however, finding enough asses to fill the stable!”

JSNMGC

I’m here for the politics.

The politics of firearm rights and how those rights relate to totalitarianism.

This is a gun rights forum.

Will/”TEX” took offense to certain aspects of those politicial discussions and became emotional.

My preference is to continue the discussion of firearm rights in the context of the steady drift toward totalitarianism.

Politicians, lawyers, judges, the media, law enforcement, and the military all play a role in the loss of freedom. The United States is different from many other countries that have gone through this evolution and it will be interesting to see how things progress.

Wild Bill

Oh, the politics. Well. based upon your writings, I thought you were here to quibble and carp, alongside the hater, My mistake.

JSNMGC

It is your mistake.

Will/”TEX” became unhinged when it was pointed out that local law enforcement frequently enforces unconstitutional gun control laws, they have called in the BATFE, they cooperate with the BATFE, and many of them are corrupt liars on power trips.

Why do you attempt to cover for Will/”TEX?”

Will/”TEX” tried to use his dumb cop tactics against people who would have none of it.

Wild Bill

You judge it a mistake? Well, you are not the judge.
Nor are you qualified to judge hinged or unhinged.
By the way how does an activist earn a living?

Russn8r

I’d rather be an honest hater than a dishonest passive-aggressive hater, insecure dude bragging about his “credentials”

Wild Bill

I did not bring up my accomplishments on my own, but if someone is dumb enough to ask, I gladly recite them. Who is that professor from Hamline that you claim to know? I probably know them. I sure hope that is not one of your lies.

Russn8r

LOL, yes you did. You do it all the time.

Wild Bill

Only when challenged, and you stepped into the ambush.

Russn8r

No one’s making you read anything, Doctor Bill.

Wild Bill

Absent Ammoland you could not get printed in a high school newspaper.

Russn8r

That’s funny. Where’s The Chimp? Did you forget to feed him today? Forget to clean his stall?

Wild Bill

Don’t you have some whiskey to drink?

Russn8r

Don’t you?

Oldman

The only thing I am sure about is that, we (mostly the others here on this forum) are damn sick and tired of the horse dung that you and the other one are flinging at anybody that does not fall into your two-step analysis and does not follow YOU as the Gospel. Give it up and just state your case, and knock off calling names and using innuendos and lies. That’s all. As mark Levine would say, “I’m Done”!

JSNMGC

Oldman, the name-calling was done by Will/”TEX.” I took it in stride for a couple months before I began pointing out that he is extremely emotional and has a low IQ. I notice you, like Wild Bill, have never complained about Will/”TEX’s” profanity, name-calling, and lying. You do the same thing as Will/”TEX” – you make high-level claims and refuse to be specific. What lies have I told? If you believe I’m wrong about something, say it and we can discuss. I’ll post a comment and Will/”TEX” responds with calling me a moron and claiming I don’t know anything. He… Read more »

Wild Bill

Well, what are your accomplishments? Why should we believe you?

JSNMGC

This is how we went down the road on your credentials. You seem to believe: Credentials of the person making an argument are important to supporting the argument; and People who don’t want to provide their credentials (for two reasons) don’t have any credentials. Neither of those beliefs are correct. You then refused to provide your credentials (what specific degrees you earned at each institution and what work experience you have that is relevant to those degrees) – not that it matters, buy it is hypocritical (just like when you ignore Will/”TEX’s” lack of civility). Once again, you use “we.”… Read more »

Wild Bill

No, no you have it wrong. If you declare something on your own merit (a fact or theory), then you put your credibility into question. That is one of the many rules of forensics. That is why I footnote and use citations. If you are going to be in politics you better learn the rules of debate. The next step is to call the credibility of the declarant into question. I did. Self8r demanded mine. I shared. And now both of you refuse to answer the question, “Why should anyone believe you” The fact that the rules are foreign to… Read more »

Russn8r

Can’t stop lying. You never shared.

“Credentials are critical if you want to do something professional…doctor or lawyer or teacher or professor. But there are a lot of other things where it’s not clear they’re that important.”
Peter Thiel’

That’s if your credentials are real and relevant, which your are not. You’re just stroking yourself, “Doctor” Bill

Wild Bill

First yours and then I will specify. Where did you do your undergrad work? And your doctorate?

Russn8r

No thanks. You’re a copsucker, so you want to dox everyone, but I don’t do that. You bragged, YOU DOX

Wild Bill

Nasty language, indeed. I offered, but you have to ante up.
You claim to know a professor at Hamline, if you do that would be quite the coincidence. How did you meet them? Every professor that I know from Hamline is still in Minnesota.

Russn8r

You first, DOXX man.

Wild Bill

Your turn, GED boy.

Russn8r

Your turn, phantasy ranch.

Wild Bill

I have many accomplishments to brag about.

Russn8r

Your “accomplishments” are cowardly diversions that add nothing to your lame arguments.

Wild Bill

Come on anything that takes this long is probably made up. You should know your own alma mater off the top of your head.

Russn8r

Give it up. Come out of your hidey hole, “Doctor” Bill!

Wild Bill

Come on fess up … you only have a ged.

Russn8r

Yeah. You got me, “Doctor Bill”

Wild Bill

You can tell by the way you write and debate that you are not a learned man and hate yourself for it. Go take some classes. Audit a class and you don’t even have to take an exam, but it will not count toward a degree.

Russn8r

You can tell by the way you write and debate that you are not a learned man and hate yourself for it. Go take some classes. Audit a class and you don’t even have to take an exam, but it will not count toward a degree.

Wild Bill

Having a reason to know is also critical if the matter asserted is based upon your say so.

Russn8r

I have a reason to know, “Doctor Bill”. You bragged, you tell.

Wild Bill

You think Peter Thief is a person … sad.

  1. Definition of PETER THIEF by Oxford Dictionary .
  2. noun plural noun peter thieves informal Australian A prisoner who steals from another prisoner’s cell. More example sentences Origin 1950s from peter, in the Australian sense ‘a prison cell’.
Russn8r

Peter Thiel. Not Thief. One of Trump’s advisors. Guess you’re not an eye doctor, Bill.

JSNMGC

No Wild Bill, an argument made on an internet forum should be able to stand on its own, based on the logic and supporting evidence. If someone states that their opinion on economics and finance is correct because they have a law degree from a second-tier law school and a degree in social justice, criminal justice, or political science from an obscure midwestern university and that is why they are correct – that is ridiculous. Furthermore, even in the courtroom, two witnesses providing expert testimony and (after stating their credentials) may have different testimonies. The reasons for their conclusions are… Read more »

Last edited 1 month ago by JSNMGC
Wild Bill

If the mater asserted is based upon your say so, then you are subject to questioning. Otherwise there is no reason to believe the declarant.

Russn8r

Stop deflecting. Prove you went to Hamline.

Crickets Chirping…

Wild Bill

Hamline U is a Methodist University, in St. Paul, Mn near Roseville, and about a mile from the MN State Fair grounds. They have six services every Sunday and ring the bells prior to each service, but their library is closed on Sundays.
They don’t make you go to services, but you will be awake, but not in the library.

JSNMGC

What specific degrees did you earn from Hamline?

Wild Bill

I earned two degrees from there. I will tell you the first one and then it is your turn to relate your undergrad work. Agreed?

Wild Bill

Nothing to offer?

JSNMGC

Starting all over again on a new day – why are you asking if I have nothing to offer?

Wild Bill

What do you get reprogramed each morning or just have a poor memory? Where did you do your undergrad work? Last chance.

Last edited 1 month ago by Wild Bill
JSNMGC

Try taking a deep breath and attempt to not go negative. I explained, in detail, last night why I’m not going to provide that information. Regarding your comment about me not being interested in real conversation, take a look at what happened last night. I came across a news story which provided yet more support for something I had said. I posted the link in support of what I said (you have accused me of making unsupported claims and Will/”TEX” says I never support my points of view – something that is absolutely false). Oldman jumps in and called me… Read more »

Russn8r

Still hiding your false “credentials”, “Doctor Bill”. I require names and dates. Go feed the chimps.

Wild Bill

You require whiskey by the quart.

Wild Bill

That is called the “The Royal We”. It is perfectly acceptable use of English. Didn’t you know?

Russn8r

Too clever by half.

Wild Bill

Too 8r, by a whole.

Russn8r

That’s what you got from that faux Hemline PhD? Sad.

Wild Bill

Sad that you could not finish high school.

JSNMGC

Even more obnoxious (I had given you the benefit of the doubt).

Wild Bill

How do you know it is obnoxious when you don’t know the meaning of the traditional use. You jumped to a conclusion based upon how it sounds.

JSNMGC

I do know the meaning and your use of it is obnoxious.

Why do you avoid all the troubling questions?

Oldman

Double yawn,,,,,,,,

Russn8r

“mostly the other [dirty-cop-sucking sock-pups] on this forum.”

Wild Bill

No one is forcing you to be on this forum.

Russn8r

No one is forcing you to be on this forum.

Oldman

From here on out, I for one, shall call you two individuals by what you appear to me to be a WWW tag team. Just like the shows, you are both fake from your toes to your gills. Henceforth you shall be called Team JR. Just know that you can teach a pig to sing, but you won’t like the song, and you will just irritate the pig… yawn X 10

Russn8r

4 score & 7 yrs ago “Oldman’s” mom birthed a pompous hypocrite. From here on, I for one, shall call you by what you appear to be (sic) a WWW tag team. Just like the shows, you are fake from your toes to your gills. Henceforth you shall be called Team Oldman-WB-WillTEX-FordWill aka TEAM OWNED, TO or just OWNED. Just know you can teach a pig to sing, but you won’t like the song, and you will just irritate the pig… yawn X 10

LOOO-ZERS! Loo-who…ze her!

Last edited 1 month ago by Russn8r
Oldman

Tag Team JR, Apparently, you lack originality. Let’s see; In the past three days you have said, “Monkey see Monkey do”, at least twice. You and the J part of the team have copied and pasted so many comments by so many that it is boring…..not only to me but the rest of us. Now,say again and make dumb comments, because you are both under twenty one and you can claim ignorance. When they come for you, this time, I can tell you, this time and next time and next time, you will again continue the match and continue to… Read more »

JSNMGC

Oldman, why don’t you actually discuss specifics?

I gave you a few things to think about. Rest-up and tomorrow maybe you will feel up to it.

Russn8r

He’s a pinch hitter for “Doctor Bill”. Same effeminate leftist M.O.: Snark, passive aggression, pomposity, etc.

JSNMGC

Well, oldman, does Will’s lack of civility concern you? Does it concern you that he claims I don’t provide support for any of my comments and then he claims video evidence is invalid because it was posted on youtube and that any linked sources I provide are invalid because I frequently provide linked sources? Does it concern you that he not only supported Brailsford, but made statements about the incident that are not readily found via an internet search and he refused to provide a link to support his statments? The statements were not matters of opinion, but matters of… Read more »

JSNMGC

Well, oldman?

JSNMGC

Oldman?

Wild Bill

Done with you.

Russn8r

Done with you.

JSNMGC

I’m not done with you. Why do you attempt to cover for Will/”TEX?” Why do you not want people to talk about certain subjects as part of discussions on gun rights? Why do you admire someone’s enthusiasm when they ask for the addresses of BATFE agents and talk about their children, but you don’t like people making factual comments about local LEOs enforcing even more onerous gun laws? Why do you “make observations” about the civility of some people, but not Will’s emotional use of profanity? Why do tell me quoting Will is problematic and one of the reasons is… Read more »

Wild Bill

I think that I have explained about the tradition of Southern courtesy. When people disagree, they something nice first. Why do you associate with an unlearned, unprepossessing, obviously self loathing dullard, that reflects so poorly on you?

Russn8r

More projection/deflection from “Doctor Bill”

JSNMGC

You have tried to rally Southern tradition to support your ways before. You are hijacking a Southern tradition, misusing it, and turning it into a smug way to avoid a conversation.

The general reputation of law enforcement suffers when LEOs don’t call out bad actors.

When people like Will support Brailsford and you cover for Will, you are making LE look bad.

Russn8r

Passive aggression, the M.O. of menopausal women and leftists.

Wild Bill

No, I have adopted that southern tradition because I am in the South, and surrounded by Southerners. They are a fascinating people with their own way of communicating in rich and diplomatic ways.
As to your last two paragraphs … well bless your little heart those are your unsupported opinions. Good night.

Russn8r

Passive aggression, the M.O. of menopausal women and leftists. No wonder you’re so good at it.

Wild Bill

Well, then, your menopause is showing.

Russn8r

Nice try, from the queen of insecure passive aggression. Your imaginary “credentials” fixation is sad.

JSNMGC

I am familiar with the ways of Southerners and you co-opted a tradition for your own smug, passive-aggressive, dismissive purposes because once again you started an argument, got owned, and ran away.

Oldman

WB… Time for us, all of us, who mainly stay out of this juvenile diatribe, to ignore the TAG Team. Honestly, it is the only thing that will work, and so I urge you to ignore it. I am gonna do the best I can to do the same, and if a majority of us would pick up our shields and armor and fight back we could rid ourselves of this vermin, for once and all. Because of the immaturity of our foes, they will have nothing else to do but turn on each other and the gods will have… Read more »

Wild Bill

I agree. They are not interested in real conversation. They think that getting a rise out of us is some kind of victory. You came closer than any other to getting them to be civil. I am done with their lies and acerbic vile. Merry Christmas and a Happy New Rifle!

JSNMGC

I’m interested in real conversation.

You accuse me of what you, Will/TEX, and oldman do – act uncivil.

You accuse me of lying, don’t point out any things you think I lied about, and then ignore the lies of Will, for whom you white knight.

Oldman

@WB A Merry Christmas to you too and have a happy new sniper rifle…

Wild Bill

That is an intriguing thought. MC, brother

Russn8r

Hypocrisy/projection. You embrace the sock-pup tag team of WB-Will-TEX-FordWILL etc. Coy passive-aggression, deflection, ad hominem, swearing: M.O. to bury issues.

“I urge you to ignore it”…”If a majority of us (sock pups) fight back we could rid ourselves of this vermin

Which is it? Ignore? Or “fight back” (smear-cancel)? Idea: Deal with issues. Don’t hide behind ad hominem smokescreens when you disagree.

Don’t pretend you don’t see vile attacks launched on those who note victims of oppression, murder & gun control by state-local “LEOs”. If we don’t take it lying down the sock-pup LEO-tag-team calls us troublemakers, “vermin” etc

Last edited 1 month ago by Russn8r
JSNMGC

Oldman?

JSNMGC

Oldman, you come in and make high-level comments and then take off. If you want to change the dynamics of the board you should engage in an honest conversation.

Oldman

I take off when I want to. Absoluety no reason to have to talk with you about it. To talk with you, I would have to be a moron, so maybe I might understand.o you. So far you make no sense.

Oldman

Yawn

Russn8r

Yawn

Oldman

I’m asleep

Wild Bill

He said that he is done with you.

JSNMGC

Well, I wasn’t done with him.

Careful, Will/”TEX” doesn’t like it when people interject themselves into a conversation between two others.

Oldman, you made comments – why do you run away when they are addressed?

Wild Bill

You are not in charge.

Russn8r

You are not in charge of anything but your sock puppets.

Oldman

Because I said it all. No reason to explain it to you again. What are ya’ STUPID!…………

Russn8r

He said? Getting confused on which of your sock pups said what again, “Doctor Bill”

Oldman

Yawn

JSNMGC

You sound sleepy, Oldman.

Oldman

I am….you are BORING…………

Oldman

Again, I AM sleepy….YAWN

Oldman

Who cares TAG TEAm Jr

Russn8r

What’s up, OWNED Team Sr?

Last edited 1 month ago by Russn8r
Wild Bill

Makes you wonder if they act like this at home!

Russn8r

More projection by Doctor Bill’s sock puppets.

JSNMGC

Replace Fried with a better person.

Do not transfer responsibility for issuing concealed-carry licenses to the Florida Department of Law Enforcement.

Work on getting government employees out of the business of regulating who can carry a firearm they legally possess.

Ask Fried what the “insurrection” plan was – to hold Pelosi’s lectern hostage until Biden was replaced with Trump?

JSNMGC

[chuckle]

AZ Lefty

So by applying the law she is “abusing it” – Got it

Wild Bill

The great HMWIC speaks! As there was no insurrection, she is not really following the FL statute. And if there had been, I don’t think that it would qualify. Nor was the protest within the state of FL.

swmft

it has to be felony charges, state or federal @Wild Bill read my other she will likely get removed ,or have to reinstate most of these without fees and get a rebuke from state senate

BadBilly21

Maybe you can expound a little on the specific law(s) you are referring to above and how she is applying it in this specific situation. Providing additional information could help the rest of us “Got it” get it like you.

Montana454Casull

She is not applying any laws just abusing her power to infringe on people rights who have different political affiliations than her . Nice try though Lefty Ass , I mean Az lefty !

swmft

various reasons: if you become legally incapacitated, are committed to a mental institution, get convicted of a felony ,or a misdemeanor domestic violence charge or have a repeat violence or domestic violence injunction granted against you. it can be suspended if you are under indictment for a crime that would have more than 1 year in jail, ,problem isno charges have been filed .government has been trying to use secret courts of “patriot” act and not even these judges will touch it fbi did too much instigating ,over 70 agents and associates identified so far this looks like the” Islamic… Read more »

Bubba

You should have been swallowed at birth.
She has a medical marijuana license. On the 4473 is precludes her from buying or owning a firearm. Why does she have firearms and a CCW?
She should be arrested and charged with felony perjury.

https://www.atf.gov/file/60211/download

Last edited 1 month ago by Bubba