Q LLC & the Honey Badger AR Pistol Dilemma, the Real Issue is…NFA

Q LLC Honey Badger AR Pistol img IG the_official_q
Q LLC Honey Badger AR Pistol img IG the_official_q

USA – -(AmmoLand.com)- “Q” LLC was a recent victim of the ATF’s dreaded “cease and desist” letter.  There are obvious questions that need to be asked and answered, so let’s delve into this.

Q’s Honey Badger is a nifty little pistol.  It is quite small in terms of overall length, which I happen to really like in any pistol.  I truly don’t want or need a 10” barrel unless I’m using it to hunt Iowa Whitetail Deer.  For just about any other application, I’d prefer a shorter barrel and a very short overall weapon length.  Q has been part of a pack of industry leaders with that obvious goal in mind.

When it comes to pistol anatomy, I’ve done some pretty wild stuff in my shop in efforts to customize weapons for a customer’s needs or requests.  The pistol brace was a great invention.  For years the problem of a high barrel centerline made using weapons in this configuration a real chore.  The stability simply wasn’t present.  The wrist brace helps with this problem immensely.  That’s part 1 of the consideration.  The ability to ‘shoulder’ a weapon like a pistol is part 2.

When in the field, competing, or sighting in any number of weapons, I’ve used just about any and every method of stabilization possible in order to achieve a more solid hold on a weapon, which is foundational to safety.  Additionally, when you’re solid you’re also consistent.  When you’re consistent, you achieve accuracy.  I get paid to build and customize guns for the purposes of accuracy.

Whether I’m bracing my trusty 1866 Yellowboy in the crook of a tree limb, laying my 6.5PRC chambered precision rifle across sandbags, pulling my BRN-180S pistol in tight to my shoulder, or bracing my 460SW X-Frame against the window opening of my cozy little deer hunting hut, I’m seeking at every turn to stabilize my weapon for safety and performance.  There is no other reason I choose to do so.  Which is why this whole, “Oh, you can’t shoulder that weapon, you sure can with this one that is a half-inch longer,” or “Bracing your gun against a tree is cheating,” or whatever silly things people say are just plain asinine.  Weapons are weapons by configuration, period.  The inherent nature of any weapon doesn’t change by virtue of being shouldered, slung, leaned against a tree, or across some sandbags.

Only a mental midget, post-modern progressive liberal, or bureaucrat would say otherwise.

So why all this ATF hassle for builders of AR Pistols?

Has Q stepped over some line with a well-built pistol?  Is this a shot across the bow of the pistol stabilizer industry?  Is Q being targeted, or is there more injustice on the horizon?  If you take a step back and look at just how stupid some of these regulations are, you get a sense of how poorly conceived they were in their origination.  I mean, seriously…  Who gives a tinker’s damn about the differences between a 16” barreled carbine and a 15.9” barreled carbine?  The whole idea behind some arbitrary and magical barrel length that blossoms an SBR is pretty darned silly.  Unless the ATF intends on stating any weapon that has a barrel less than 16” suddenly illegal, the entire premise of a “Short Barreled Rifle” is the equivalent of a strawberry size wart on Helen of Troy’s snoot…  The entire “SBR” precept is ugly, unbecoming, and no longer necessary if it ever was?  With the innovations of our current and future industry, a serious case can be made for the “SBR” to simply go away.

I don’t have any personal stake in Q.  I am not taking a position of solidarity with Q.  Rather, I’m asking you to seek truth here.  I can’t for the life of me differentiate a qualifying difference between the intentions and applications of the brace on the Honey Badger and any of the braces you can buy right here at Brownells.

AR AK Rifle Pistol Stabilizing Braces
AR AK Rifle Pistol Stabilizing Braces

I hope this gets sorted out pretty quickly.  There is no reason for the power of the government to bleed a business dry with legal fees and losses of revenue.  Especially when I can’t even find the proverbial hair that is being split.  …And my perspective comes from that of a gunsmith and the owner of a custom shop.

My wife would tell you I’m none too bright.  She’d probably be right.  But, I’m pretty good at what I do, and there are no intelligible differences in the Q product I can find, other than the outspoken nature of the owner.  Could that be the problem?  I’m forced to ponder this possibility.  Wisely, Q offered a letter crafted by a lawyer back to ATF.

Another possibility?  There are grumblings that many in positions of authority with various agencies, bureaus, and departments continue to find themselves at odds with the President of the United States.  Some might say playing this card just before the election would stir up one particularly motivated group of voters.  This idea looks far-fetched to me.  However, in full disclosure, we’ve witnessed it recently with other pockets of government…  *cough* FBI…  Hey, don’t look at me like I’m nutty.  I couldn’t even pound the keyboard with these kinds of thoughts if we hadn’t seen so many examples of bad actors using their positions for anything but their job description and the mission statement of their departments.  I’m not being honest with you if I don’t offer this possibility.  You’re thinking about it too.

Take Action?!

So, what are pistol brace owners and pro-gun advocates to do in the interim?  For those of you who want to be part of the solution, which should be all of you, I’d use any number of the “Take Action” campaigns to make your voice heard.  NRA has one as does the FRAC (Firearms Regulatory Accountability Coalition).  It’ll take you seconds to use either or both.  I highly recommend you step in and help out, whether you believe you have skin in the game or not because you do.  House Representative Matt Gaetz has been vocal as well, so it isn’t just free-born Americans that are hollering here.

For the unfortunate owners of the Q product, I wish I had better news for you.

But the first thing I’d consider is pushing the two pins out of your lower and taking the top end off – separate them.  You can also register your receiver as an SBR.  That online eForm from ATF is moving along at a pretty brisk pace these days.  Here’s the letter from Q to customers for your edification.

I’ve thought long and hard about a ‘workaround’ for this, and there isn’t a lot that customers can actually do besides the suggestions in the letter Q offered them.  I’m of the rock-solid opinion, which I believe I can quantify, that there is no true value in the firearm definition of Short Barreled Rifle (a rifle having a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length).  When you think about it in those terms, you begin to see just how much time and energy is being wasted on things like this by our government.  Weapons come in more configurations now than a handful of wheel guns, a single shot 8ga shotgun, and a lever rifle – get over it.  Firearms have innovated past the design limitations we had decades ago.  There are times you realize that past practices should be righted.  Half the stuff on the NFA qualifies for reconsideration.  Ditch the SBR qualification.

Once you consider this properly, you’ll see that SBS falls squarely in the same category.  Don’t get me started on whether cans should be an NFA item…

About Michael Ware:Michael Ware

Michael is a Christian husband and father to two children. He owns and operates Controlled Chaos Arms, a premier custom weapons shop in the Midwest. He serves as Chairman of the board of Directors at the Iowa Firearms Coalition. The pursuit of truth drives him in research and his writing.

Michael enjoys shooting, hunting, and fishing throughout the Midwest and Rockies. An avid outdoorsman and tireless supporter of all Second Amendment virtues, he can be found in his gun shop, in a tree stand with his kids, or on Capitol Hill lobbying in support of Freedom and Liberty at any given time.

Some of the links on this page are affiliate links, meaning at no additional cost to you, Ammoland will earn a commission if you click through and make a purchase.
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Chicago v. Morales says a law that can’t be understood by someone of ordinary intelligence is unconstitutionally vague. If the NFA needs an entire government agency to make the determination on if something is against the law, it clearly qualifies as too vague.


Not to mention the penalties amount to cruel and unusual punishment, 10 years in prison for a $200 tax? Or a $250,000 fine!

What about Al Sharpton who owes over $4 MILLION in unpaid taxes.m

End the ATF, abolish the NFA, GCA and Hughes amendment.

Last edited 1 year ago by Arizona

And I believe that the laws are supposed to be written to where someone with a 6th grade education is able to understand them because back in the day, if a person was lucky enough to be able to attend school, if they made it to the sixth grade that was about the extent of their education because they had to work to support the family farms and business while having to hunt and trap or fish to feed the family and they were finally old enough and big or strong enough to do it. Don’t forget, Annie Oakley started… Read more »

Last edited 1 year ago by musicman44mag

not to mention that back in that time, a sixth grade educatioin was likley far more complete and advanced than most of today’s college graduates have. Who was it, Ben Franklin or maybe one of the Adams, graduated Princeton with a bachelor’s degree at 12 years of age? Was part of our US Embassy to France at fourteen.. must be J Q Adams, then….


All of this is absolutely an infringement on We The People’s absolute right to keep and bear arms. Plain and simple. Any agency or agent of any three branches recognized by the binding law of our US Constitution tells you different is a damned liar. Those three are legislative, judicial, and executive. And we got ATFE keeps getting more letters, bigger budgets, and acting as judge, jury, and executioner, literally. Show me article, section and clause enumerating this kind of power and authority to an alphabet agency. That doesn’t exist, as well as any authority for enforcing an illegal law… Read more »


The constitution does not authorize the formation of agencies to regulate rights enumerated or not.


“The laws that forbid the carrying of arms… disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.”
The ATF must be working for the criminal side in today’s world, they give no evidence of working for the law abiding side.


Vern – I read thru the other comments before I replied to see if there was a better place 😉 Your comment nailed it – atf does indeed ‘work’ for the “criminal side” – big government. Seriously, if they would concentrate on CRIMINALS instead of their tools, they ‘might’ actually be useful. The column author brings up a LOT of valid points. I certainly can’t find that elusive hair to split that he hasn’t be able to find either. Seems to me that atf’s main problem is that unelected bureaucrats are making decisions based on their personal ‘opinions’ and/or biases… Read more »


I know I am writing the choir here mostly, but the whole NFA is a blatant kick in teeth of the founding fathers understanding of the 2nd amendment and the reason for it. The fact that it exists at all is a total travesty against the Constitution itself. ALL of the provisions are in direct violation of what a MILITIA would use for weapons and what a member of the militia would be able to use to defend his family and country. We have devolved into a caste system where those who work for the “government” are allowed to have… Read more »

Ryben Flynn

The entire NFA is outdated. It came about due to the rise in crime during Prohibition, which was a direct result of the Women’s Temperance Movement started in Cleveland, Ohio in 1874.

Last edited 1 year ago by Ryben Flynn

I worked in food manufacturing my entire career w/USDA oversight. They followed same shitty procedure…where they would shut you down for something they didn’t like but wouldn’t tell you how to fix it.


The idea of an agency regulating an individual right, especially one that is protected by the supreme law of the land, is repugnant to the American ideal.

The attitudes coming from this agency only goes to show why it shouldn’t exist.

Likewise, NFA, GCA and other laws are null and void. The federal constitution explicitly prohibits the government from engaging in minor infractions of the right to arms, and we are discussing the blatant, overt violation of rights.


Where’s Trump, he’s in charge of this agency. He can fire people who don’t follow his orders. Why hasn’t he? Or, is this part of his orders in reality? He’s yet to stop them from don’t anything…


Aside from being the most powerful leader in the free-world I’m pretty sure with everything else going on in that he’s got a handle on it somewhere along the line of his overly busy schedule?


Semper Fi USMC ground pounder. I agree. Why would he want to do anything to give the left more ammo in their fight against our freedom. Nothing has been determined LEGALLY and it is still a push to see what they can get away with and a ploy to drag President Trump into a fight of their communist making. So let’s just sit back and wait and when the time comes, then he can flex his power and take action to get the ball rolling to straighten out this mess.
Trump 2020 for a free America.


COME ON….. Trump is lounging around somewhere in the White House either watching TV, having his hair ‘done’, or firing off some drivel on social media. (actually he’s probably jetting to some swing state begging for votes, just like every politician up for election)


O K Joe, you can go back to sleep now.


Reconfigure a personally owned Honey Badger because of a brand new totally inconsistent ATF opinion (not law)? I don’t think so.


I really wouldn’t mind seeing SBR’s SBS’s and silencers or suppressors taken off of the NFA … but in the end I don’t think that machine guns or fully automatic weapons should be taken off… I know many here will probably disagree with that. As much as I think I’m responsible enough to own a fully automatic weapon… with all the antifa bullshit going on right now, I don’t wanna see those in the hands of just anyone… in the end I don’t think that machine guns or fully automatic weapons should be taken off… I know many here will… Read more »

Last edited 1 year ago by Cyph

I think that I would love to shoot a fully auto again as I did in the Marie Corp but it really isn’t needed yet for defense purposes against a tyrannical government; however, I do think that if it is not auto, it should be legal without a permit and that constitutional carry should be provided for all states in America and enforced by the federal government on commie states like Kommiefornia, Washington, New York etc. I hear and read of people turning AR15 into fully auto and getting prison time and fines for doing it so in the event… Read more »


I don’t know what era you were in the corps from, but the first time I fired the BAR was a hoot. By the time the forth round was out the barrel I was on my backside and the DI was flat on the deck of the bunker we were firing out of. I picked it up and set it in place and fired out the rest of my allotment of rounds with me in control. Like I said, it was a hoot. Not everyone needs a machine gun, and if it comes down to it, we can take it… Read more »


Do you REALLY think that if Antifa/BLM wanted full auto weapons, they’d be prevented getting them by the NFA and tax requirements? Hah!!! The Mexicna drug cartels have no problem getting their hands on them, and using them. Weapons went south with ease during the kinyun’s administration.. Fast and Furious was only the visible part of the iceburg. SOme have unconvered records of thousands of full auto weapons being placed into the hands of the Sinaloa Cartel, for only one. By OUR government. The same boys that DO NOT want yuo and I to have them made sure the narcotraficantes… Read more »


the letters from Q’s attorney and matt gaetz kind of shove the BS back up the arse of the worthless abc agency. for them to change rules after this amount of time is without merit and i think legally indefensible. hopefully the letter from gaets, yobo, posey and stube, 2 florida boys, will get their attention and reign them in. i said hopefully because as we have seen in the past they believe they are able to violate rights without repercussions, and that may be their biggest mistake.


gregs . . . thank you for your post. Governments everywhere in this country violate our constitutional rights regarding the Second Amendment EVERY DAY!!! It is time that American Patriots began to get plumb nasty about these governmental transgressions and did something about the “Little Hitlers” who shove them in our face every day! It is time that we got plumb damn MAD and began showing these AZZHOLES what ” . . . shall not be infringed.” means!


An SBR is a braced pistol for all intents and purposes. If a six inch barrel is legal for a pistol why does it become illegal for a rifle? Actually, pay money to the government, and it is no longer illegal. The NFA is what needs to go, along with current ATF leadership.


Very well written.


Many of u may not like what I have to say, but that has always been a fact since the dawn of time. Me, registered as an Independent in 1970 as I did not much care to belong to a so call Party Gang. Yep garduated from highschool, got my voter registration filled out, and got my Draft # to Nam, plus I could legally drink 3.2 Beer is SD, and if I remember correctly I could purchase more firearms without an adult having to sign. The NRA attracted me into the shooting sports at age 12, and I have… Read more »


Until the conception of the brace, any such device was considered an SBR. ATF took a step towards end running the NFA with the brace authorization; however, ATF also stated at that time it would rule on each brace development as an individual item, not a carte blanche. Rather than holding ATF responsible, hold the politicians who enacted the laws, and judicial systems that support or fail to overrule them, responsible. I see so much finger pointing at ATF (it has had its foibles, some rather serious, but is also the most gun friendly federal agency we have, and certainly… Read more »


“the most gun friendly federal agency we have”

Well, there’s the dumbest thing I’ve read all year!

Last edited 1 year ago by Stag

Well yes and no, remember that Washington DC is full of academic weenies (from BOTH parties) who HATE guns. The higher ups in every agency fill that bill while many of the grunts in BATFE really are gun aficionados.


Stag . . . Obviously, Dactylographer has never had to DEAL with the minions of the BATFE! If he did, he would see how stupid his comment is!!!