Apathy will Kill the 2nd Amendment and End your Right to own a Firearm

Some of the Guns Confiscated and Destroyed in Australia
SO what are you doing to help defend the constitution?

U.S.A.-(Ammoland.com)- When was the last time you went shooting? When was the last time you attended a Friends of NRA dinner? When was the last time you did anything except complain about the NRA?

Last November gun owners joined together to stop Hillary Clinton. Her calls for a ban on all semi-automatic firearms, an Australian style mass buyback and forced registration leading to confiscation were what rallied many of us. So let me ask you a question. How many of you know and accept that Hillary’s views were not unique, but represent the actual views of the leadership in the Democrat party?

She’s never changed or renounced this position. Chuck Schumer is even worse. If in power, he intends to hammer guns out of existence with new legislation.

So let me ask a question: what are you doing to help defend your right to own a firearm? (I’ll wait while you think about it.)

Ok, I’ve waited. SO what are you doing to help defend the constitution? Reading Ammoland is a good start, but I was hoping for something more. I was hoping you’d get off your butt and fight to keep your rights.


Look at CA, and NY or NJ. Judges rule they’ve gone too far and they simply ignore the judge.

There are 120,000,000 gun owners in the U.S. we need to shake off our apathy are stay active.

Gun ownership is on the rise. We need to help new gun owners and support our community.

Three things you can do:

  1. Attend a Friends of NRA event. This link will help you find a local event.
  2. Make sure your NRA membership is paid and up to speed. 40 million gun owners THINK they’ve paid their dues. Make sure yours are paid.
  3. Vote in the next election. CHALLENGE your candidates on supporting gun rights.

Get off your butt and stop letting otherscarry your load.

Only 119 million in total voted in 2016. There are 120 million-gun owners. A 5% increase in gun owner turn out, and we can preserve our rights and freedoms forever.

So I’ll say it again. Get off your butt and get active. If not you have no one but yourself to blame when Newson in CA or President Booker in DC come to confiscate your guns. Don’t tell me you’ll fight… you won’t. If you don’t have it in you to do something now, you’ll sit home if the heavy lifting ever comes. Be a patriot not when you can, when it’s easy.

About Don McDougall:Don McDougall

Don McDougall is an NRA instructor and member of the Los Padres “Friends of the NRA” committee. If he’s not at the range you will find him setting the record straight with on gun issues and gun safety onAmmoLand Shooting Sports News.

  • 73 thoughts on “Apathy will Kill the 2nd Amendment and End your Right to own a Firearm

    1. You know, if it did not happen so often, when people visualize and create a solution for a problem before completely rejecting it within the same instant should be shocking. Let this be evidence for everyone to read.

      There is an individual here who is quite upset with me right now. Here are his own words.

      “I would love to be able to vote for someone other than the dems or repubs but until they show they actually have a chance I’m not going to vote for them when the polls show they may get 5% of the vote if they are lucky. I hate being stuck with only 2 real choices but until we figure a way to get more people to vote for a 3rd party I won’t waste my vote.”

      I wont vote for someone because not enough people vote for them….. That says it all right there. If you want someone to get more votes and be a threatening “Real Choice”, go out and vote for them. Forest through the trees people.

      1. What’s funny is how you think yourself so Important that you are announcing evidence for people to look at like everyone is hanging on your everyword. News flash no one cares about you or you opinion. You see yourself as a defender of the weak, a superhero, a legend in your own mind. See for me to be upset I would have to care about you.
        As for your long winded several paragraph love fest over how smart you are and playing me like a fiddle I knew as soon as I didn’t respond to your last post you would waste more of your time and tell me how great you are in an even longer way. Also no veiled threat of violence just figured you for a cellar dweller who doesn’t know how to interact with people in person and figured you probably have been beat up if you do. I’m still going by same name on here but I wonder how many aliases you have.

        1. @ Repo

          Funny, For a guy who said he doesn’t care, and that I wasn’t worth his time, I still have you responding don’t I? =D

          Personally, as I have stated before, I’m not worried about what anyone else thinks of me. My purpose here was as stated, and so far I have continually advocated for the individual right to choose who and how you vote. The one part I attack is hypocrisy, and while I do respect individual rights, that doesn’t mean I wont call attention to willful and negligent stupidity. This post was made in general not for you, but for anyone else arriving here and reading through comments before writing their own. That is why I did not mention you by name, though admittedly it would not be hard for anyone to figure out considering how well you danced. Lets review.

          1. You attempted to castigate Rob J. for stating his personal opinion of conscience as compared to yours, labeling his stance as a wasted vote, and attempting to delegitimize his opinion by claiming it effectively rendered him as “Giving a vote away to Obama.” This was you going after him, when he had not made his original comment to you in the first place.

          2. You have openly admitted your voting tendencies are tantamount to eating a “Crap Sandwich” and that as long as you have enough bread, you will happily swallow that turd every time instead of trying to effect change. Your own statements.

          3. Linking point one and two together, you openly referenced your fear of a Florida 2000 runoff situation, Hi-Larry Clinton’s popular vote numbers ala LA County in 2016, and personal opinion that 3rd party candidates wrongly rob votes from your preferred Turds who show up when the General election rolls around.

          4. Only after attacking Rob J, and retting an amiable response back did you then acknowledge a right to differing opinions and toning back your rhetoric. However, being called out on that hypocrisy as well as further examples through our own exchanges highlighting and confirming points one through three.

          Do you wish to at this time deny any of the four points I have just made?

          With that in mind, I’m going to advise you not to do so. You see, one of the unique benefits to Ammoland’s system is that you cannot delete comments you have made previously once they become an inconvenience to you. What I have done, and I openly admit this is not a fair or respectful tactic in advance, is work you up to cause you to post in an attempt to distract or protect yourself from the flawed nature of your initial comment. Every comment you post in an attempt to shore up credibility to your statements while trying to get me to capitulate ends up being more evidence that is now permanently attached to the alias “Repo” until such time as Ammoland runs defunct or chooses to wipe this article and all related comments clean off the site.

          In plain language, I handed you a shovel and allowed you start digging. The question is now, will you continue? =)

          PS~ Vanns40, and Wild Bill for that matter (Even though he and I have vehemently argued against each other at times in the past) can vouch for my use of a single alias. Also, funny how you keep trying to push the idea of me getting beat up. Still haven’t met anyone with enough balls to try it since I was ten years old. It’s good for a chuckle though to know that is where your mind wants to go.

          1. You proved you can cut an paste stuff I said and change the context of what I said. I also never said I wouldn’t waste my time responding to you I said you are boring and long winded and have a very over inflated sense of self worth. You are the type that will do mental gymnastics to convince yourself you are right and winning some competition with someone when really your just playing with yourself. You claim vicory by playing both sides so you can claim if I respond you made me do it or if I don’t you made me do that as well. I bet when you go to vegas you bet on black and red then claim victory when one of them inevitably come up.. you are so clever. How’s that working out for you? Simply rhetorical I don’t need an answer but you will give one anyway because you love to hear your own voice so to speak…

            1. @Repo

              Ahhh, So the fantasies about me getting beaten up, or living in a basement didn’t work, so we are moving towards a Vegas fantasy now? And you accuse others of mental gymnastics? Excuse me one moment.

              Now that I have finished laughing heartily, here is the difference between our posts.

              Yes, I can copy and paste.. It’s called “Quotation.” You know, that little thing required for credible work in college, professional research, business… Pretty much everywhere. What has you upset is that your own words are being used against you, and more so than that once you have to read them a second time you are seeing how stupid they come across as, I.E. Turd sandwich.

              Now lets examine what you are doing. You don’t cite examples. You simply throw everything against the wall and hope something sticks. You self diagnose through your own perception in an attempt to build your own ego up and hope others don’t notice that you are not backing your comments up with any evidence.

              Lets expose a little hypocrisy here.

              “i’m tired of going back and forth with you it’s boring and waiting for the filters here to show the reply just makes it not worth it”

              Funny, looks like you were tired of responding and it was no longer worth it to keep responding, yet time and again I can rile you up and agitate you into commenting. Hence my claim

              How about the new one?

              “I don’t need an answer but you will give one anyway because you love to hear your own voice so to speak…”

              Translation “If you post a comment after I said that, you lose and I win, You lose and I win!” Funny, who was it saying something about someone needing to be right and hear their own voice, playing both sides?

              Since I have not changed anything I have done so far, I will even outline it for you. Since every post on here has to deal with the same two points, Step one Be Consistent, step two If you want me to vote along side you then fix the problems that make me unable to do so. That has been the same the entire time, no two sides about it. In exposing your hypocrisy, this has been my plan.

              1. Highlight your words and actions
              2. Point out where the hypocrisy lies in your statement.
              3. Force you to keep posting comments
              4. Sit back and watch you destroy your own credibility.

              At no time do I want you to stop posting. I may tell you when it is not wise to do so, but never do I want you to stop posting. I fully support the First Amendment and your right to voice your opinion. I just happen to be using it to allow you to make a fool out of yourself, which triggers you to try and make up for it by posting again and hoping you will have an “Aha!” moment that can shut me up. If you haven’t figured it out yet, I’m not doing this to “Win”. I’m doing this so everyone can see just how stupid being a hypocrite is. Be Consistent when you say something.

              Now, There will be a second comment tonight, And I have a feeling you will love it even more.

    2. Dear Don McDougall,

      My rights are my own, as are my principles. Every day I work and fight to educate those around me to what rights actually are, what the constitution actually says, and why it is still important today.

      That being said The NRA, you, and the horse you rode in on can all go screw yourselves.

      The NRA has a host of problems, not the least of which are Grover Norquist, shrinking cowardice, and complete silence on major self defense cases dealing with judicial maleficence. You idiots continually come on Ammoland and demand my support(or that of those like me) without doing a freaking thing to address the issues we have based on moral principle that have been part and parcel to the NRA for DECADES now!!!! When people like myself don’t immediately cave and fall in line like the good little peons you want us to be, you accuse us of apathy, treason, or laziness. You have your own head shoved SO FAR UP YOUR OWN BACKSIDE that it is physically and mentally impossible for you to see that it is people like myself who are having to work far harder trying to contain and undo the messes and stupidity caused by the Jack Wagons in the NRA!!!!!!!!

      Once again, I will continue to speak out against you and your stupidity, urging others to avoid the NRA and support other local groups that actually are on the ground fighting instead of getting fat in D.C. until you can figure out how to reverse your case of Cranial Rectal Insertion you seem to be in a perpetual state of. If you want my support so badly, then get off your fat backside and FIX THE NRA FIRST!!!!!!

      PS~ Have a nice day, if you have the intellectual integrity to actually read an opposing point of view.
      The Rev

    3. The only slippery slope is the NRA trading away gun rights little by little the bump fire is just the latest not the first.

    4. Rather than become voting members of the NRA, snowflakes just bitch about how bad the organization is. Instead of whining and crying, why don’t you take control?

      1. What’s that old saying? Those who do not learn from the past are doomed to repeat it?

        The NRA has been changed before, the Cincinnati Revolution if I remember correctly. And we’re back to the same place we were before then. The NRA is a corrupt institution, and I would bet it’s because of fudds like you.

        Which is why I took my money to the GOA and other organizations. As did many others. If I wanted to change the NRA now (ignoring their past like a moron) I would have to support them for 5 years before I could do anything, then hope that they don’t screw with the votes anyways since it’s all hush hush and secretive.

        Doomed to repeat it indeed.

      2. Dr. Strangelove,

        I think you need to change your name. You are more of a Gen. Ripper by any account.

        Having said that, let me ask you this. Who is the real snowflake? Is it the man who stands on his principles, or is it the whiny little hussy writing articles about how we are “Too apathetic” for doing so?

        Is it the man who is saying “Fix the NRA”, or a simpering sally writing puff pieces on behalf of the NRA to make those in control of the organization feel better about trying to restrict who people can vote for to lead?

        Or is it perhaps the guy choosing to complain about others “Bitching” about trying to call attention to real problems with the organization who actually are trying to stand up and get things changed, and choosing to throw out a red herring of “Why don’t you take control?”

        Would it be more fair then to say instead of being a snowflake, why don’t YOU sit down and listen to what peoples issues are and work together to fix the NRA? Sadly, we cannot trust people like yourself to actually do that because unless you are slapped across the face with it you don’t see the harm you yourself are causing. What it comes down to is an issue of perspective, so allow me to point out the realistic and factually based one. I’m going to flat out give you the answer, but it is up to you to summon the wisdom required to understand it. I leave it in your hands to contemplate.

        We can survive without the NRA. They can’t survive without us.

        1. @revelator. The filter system sucks here, I get your response to me in my inbox 2 hours before It shows up here. You need to look at my second post to rob j and see where I agreed with his logic and went on to say this is what I do and why and not what he should do. Having an opinion about something is not me telling someone else what to do. Which is something you seem to do alot of. So far you are the one name calling and telling everyone else what they should do or who to vote for. I gave an opinion and you have made up your mind about who I am based on that. You didn’t even read my followup comment to the guy before you got your panties all twisted up. I don’t know why my response compared to all others bothered you so much but maybe you should spend some time working that out. Either you feel the need to defend someone who didn’t seem to have a problem with what was said or you have taken an unhealthy interest in just my response.
          Show me a constitutionalist that has run for president lately and had a chance. Gowdy would be a great choice. I think Cruz could have been as well. The uninformed voters need a wakeup call and until then I will see a vote for a candidate who can’t win as wasted. While you protest vote and tell everyone how great you are because of it I’m going to hold my nose and vote for someone I get 20% of what I want from instead of being stuck with someone who is 100% against me. Or if it’s really a bad choice I may vote against the one who is the worst of the choices. It’s a crap sandwich either way but the more bread you have the less crap you eat.

          I’m tired of going back and forth with you it’s boring and waiting for the filters here to show the reply just makes it not worth it.we disagree and I really don’t care about your opinion. You take half of what I say and add some of your own thoughts about who you think I am and run with it. You say I need to apologize to someone when all you do is talk down to people and try to insult them. The internet is probably the only place you do this because most people that act like you in real life end up carrying their teeth home in their pocket. I think I remember a previous conversation with you and you were just as much of an arrogant prick that time as well. Now I’ve lowered myself to your level.. oh well worth it..

          1. @ Repo

            Ok, this is the second comment I am making tonight, being 2/6/2018.

            Since everything has come down to what I have told you is the subject of “Being Consistent”, I’d like to get us back on track as it were. So please try to stay on the subject point in your response to this comment if you make one instead of trying to change the subject per your usual routine.

            Todays question is on Context. In your response to me last night, You seemed to have a major issue with my little habit of taking your words and “Copying and pasting” as you put it. Your claim in defense of your statements is that they have been taken out of context.. Please answer my following question, and since your original statement was centered around voting against Obama we will make him the qualifying contextual source.

            When Obama was president, at multiple points he was caught off teleprompter saying something that got recorded, or was recorded saying something that was proven to be false later on. As a quick example, his debate with Romney if you will allow me to paraphrase. “I believe in the second amendment, and that it gives hunters the right to have a gun. But…. There have been too many tragedies while I have been president and we need to ban AR15 Machine guns, require registration, and universal background checks.”

            Question: Did you at any point in time criticize, attack, or correct Obama when he would later come out and say “You are taking what I said OUT OF CONTEXT. See, I did say I believe in the second amendment.”?

            So I would like to know, did you at anytime criticize El Presidente for lying and saying “You are taking what I said out of context” in private or public settings. When he said “If you like your Doctor, You can keep your doctor… PERIOD…” Did you criticize him for lying when he said it was taken out of context? When he talked about punishing his political enemies and instructed the DOD to prepare itself to combat “Right wing Extremist Terrorists, but not peaceful loving Islamasists trying to forcefully implement Sharia law” Did you call him out for saying you were taking what he said out of context then?

            If so, What makes you different, what makes you above the law? If you didn’t(since you are worried about playing both sides), what is it that makes him so bad that you cant vote for him if he was correct and you really were taking what he said out of context?

    5. The NRA quickly negotiates to trade our rights for appeasement. They did it in 1994, and just recently with the slide fire issue. They are nothing more than a lobbying agency, earning nice salaries from the member’s dues. They lost touch years ago.

    6. Strange, “Mac” still preaches fear of something prohibited by the Supteme Court as unconstiturional 10 years ago.

      1. Yea because the government has never done something unconstitutional before.

        It should have been an easy win for the NRA then, instead the not only ignored it, they actively called for it, as an organization. Certain board members called for it as well.

        There was a time (albeit short lived) the NRA said it would fight the Hughes amendment, now they’re saying bump stocks circumvent it and they need to be banned. And all the fudds agree.

        Screw the NRA, their only goal is to line their pockets with as much cash as they can while they allow our rights to be slowly eroded away.

    7. The nra is now caving into the atf over bump stocks, anything that affects speed. Tiriggers etc. go with yourl local state groups. NRA did little to nothing to help Oregon fight last gun control law. They told me they only liked to fight on national level! They need new leadership badly! Help your state organizations before nra!

    8. Comment…If you don’t like what the NRA is doing , take a page from the socialist. Be an infiltrator , so you can vote for people who will take the NRA the direction it needs to go

    9. I let my membership in the NRA expire and never renewed after they caved on the Cop Killer Bullet Ban. I then joined GOA, CCRKBA, and SAFF as a life member and never looked back. The only use I have for the NRA website is to send eMails to the worthless Senators, Representatives of the state I live in and send eMails to Trump on important issues.

    10. @Repo and billy-bob, believe what you will but my refusal to vote during that election made no difference in how my states electoral college votes went. Here in WA state we are guaranteed a blue vote the instant votes in King county are counted, no matter how strongly red we are before hand. During the last presidential election our state was deeply in the red, but swung heavily towards blue once the population sink of King county (Seattle) was counted.

      I stand behind my decision to vote neither to Romney nor Obama as neither deserved my support in any way based on my political ideology and personal beliefs, neither of which I will compromise.

      1. I understand that in your state it won’t help because you are out numbered and it won’t change how the electoral votes are applied. I live in massachusetts so it’s the same here. I’m outnumbered by liberals so I voted just to have my vote counted in the popular vote so the dems won’t be able to say they won the popular vote instead of the electoral vote in the future hopefully. Also you never know when an election will come down to a small amount of votes like Florida’s. I would love to be able to vote for someone other than the dems or repubs but until they show they actually have a chance I’m not going to vote for them when the polls show they may get 5% of the vote if they are lucky. I hate being stuck with only 2 real choices but until we figure a way to get more people to vote for a 3rd party I won’t waste my vote. Since we have to have someone win in every election I am going to always vote for the person with a chance to win and whose views are closest to mine. If I can’t vote that way then I will vote against the person who I disagree with most as my next best option of picking a candidate. It works for me.

      2. Comment…The Trump Tax Plan may have a desirable side effect . Looking at the Commiefornia tax stunts I am reading about , the super wealthy may vote with their feet , I’m hearing Florida is looking good to them . (no income tax) Since many of them also are creators of jobs if they move their companies as well (taking their hi paid employees with them) it may well break up the huge electoral college vote blocks.

        1. I completly agree.. we have been making excellent gains in state elections and that translates to less restrictive gun laws.

    11. I ended my membership with the NRA when they were in favor of the Cop Killer Bullet Ban and never looked back. I joined GOA CCRKBA and SAF as a life member. The only reason I use the NRA website is to send eMails about important gun rights issues, to the worthless Senators and Congress people of the state where I reside.

      1. There was never any such thing as a cop killer bullet. That was crap invented by the anti gun fake news media. The original bullet ban proposed would have banned all rifle ammunition used for deer hunting since it is capable of penetrating a vest. That was the goal of that anti gun legislation. NO police officer had ever been shot with a teflon coated bullet.

    12. What’s that old saying ?
      OH YA!
      I Don’t Want to be a Member of Any Club
      That Would Have Me as a Member !
      Sometimes That May Come Back to Bite You in the @$$ .

    13. I resent the fact that you think I have to be a member of ANY GROUP to fight for our rights. I call, I write, I attend open forums to make my voice heard. Let me ask y’all a question. Since the NRA caved into the Anti-2nd Amendment crowd in the early 90’s to start the unconstitutional NICS system, and now, they see it doesn’t work and in fact has been trampling on our rights, when was the last time the NRA mentioned anything about REPEALING THE NICS SYSTEM? They don’t. The simple question is, why would the founders want the American people to ask for a paid permission or not, to carry in any way, own, sell, trade and buy a firearm from the very Governments they were trying to protect us from? Crickets from the NRA. Another thing. Many Anti-2nd Amendment supporters have been advocating “gun insurance” before you are allowed to even own a gun. It’s awful peculiar the NRA started “CARRY GUARD”, GUN INSRAUNCE? Can they see the writing on the wall in the years too come and make sure they profit from it? They are about paid training classes to gun owners to get a CCW. They are profiting from a law they know is Unconstitutional while claiming they are fighting against it! Can you say CONFLICT OF INTEREST? This is why the NRA is losing credibility in their fight for protecting the true bases of the Second Amendment. One more thing, we fall into this trap by the gun grabbers by saying anti-gun, we need to be saying “anti-2nd Amendment” and remind people this isn’t about guns, but about the fight against tyranny, from govt and individuals and your right defend it by any mean and best means possible and right now, that is by the firearms..

      1. No one, at least not me, has said you have to be a member of anything. I just say you’re more effective if you are rather than being a single voice. It’s your choice, your decision.

    14. I actively support the NRA.
      A WWII vet gave me the opportunity to read every American Rifleman since the war ended. As I understood that this was the original civil rights group in the world, I took Life membership. Increased it since.
      But the idea that any organization would be right all the time, or that I would agree with them all the time, is a very strange idea. So when I think they’re off track, I let them know. Write to key players, sit down with elected representatives. Go to their office. Maintain an active correspondence. Just like I support the United States government.
      And I participate and arrange staffing for local NRA events, Actively engage with other groups.
      But there is only one national standard. The NRA is it, and if you have disagreements, don’t walk away. Make yourself heard. For all of us. For our nation.

    15. I’m not an NRA member anymore. I joined GOA and OFF here in Oregon instead. I feel the NRA has grown complacent, and when they engaged in treachery to USCCA, that was it for me. I can’t trust them.

    16. 1: the NRA is a con. Their recent actions, and the recent letters from the Board of Directors is proof of this. They wanted to give the ATF power to redefine what a machine gun is. They told no one of the comment period of the ATF wanting to do so. And they blocked/banned people on social media who brought it up, including member/lifetime members/ lifetime beneficiary members. Meanwhile national Reciprocity (which should be unneeded to begin with but the NRA benefits financially from CCW permits) is dead, the Hearing Protection Act is dead, and the only gun related laws we may see pass soon are the “fix NICS” act (which is unneeded and BS) and a Bumpstock/rate increasing device ban, all of which the NRA favors. But they’ll probably fundraise off of them.
      2: I’ve joined the GOA (who are actually doing things, even bringing up a lawsuit against the unconstitutional machine gun ban), and donated money, and am in constant contact with my state reps, and federal reps to voice my opinion, even when the Fudds at the NRA say nothing.
      3: ask the people in any liberal state how the NRA is, right now Massachusetts is violating multiple constitutionally protected right to get rid of Bump stocks and the NRA is silent.

      The NRA is no friend of gun owners, and they’ve indicated to me and many others that they don’t care about my voice but will happily call me, email me, and mail me to beg for more money while they take in millions of dollars to their persons.

    17. The basic premise is right. There are 120 million of us firearms owners (at least) out there and we need to vote together. That is all it would take. But the sad truth is many of us could care less, are uniformed, believe what the NRA says and generally are busy with other things. You dont have to be an avid firearms owner though. Just vote pro 2A rights. And if you could bring one convert to vote also, that becomes a landslide. LEts not bicker between us over AR’s, concealed carry, ammo bans and so on. Vote for our rights. That power is waiting to be grabbed by us.

    18. Screw the NRA ! LaPierre and Cox have screwed members many times. My “favorite” being former Nevada fed senator and communist anti-gunner Harry Reid being given THOUSANDS of membership dollars by LaPierre.

    19. 1: Screw the NRA they are no friends of mine, they are no friends of gun owners. They proved this by wanting the ATF to have the power to redefine machine guns to include rate increaseing devices, and then told no one. They also have a history of promoting gun control, and then campaigning off of it to line their pockets.
      2: I recently joined the GOA and donated money
      3: I’m in constant contact with my reps on the state level and federal level voicing my opinion, even when the NRA decides “hey that gun control will be good we can fund raise off of that”
      4: Screw the NRA

    20. I won’t be renewing my NRA membership. The current leadership in the NRA has sold law abiding gun owners down the river. They think if they give the gun grabbers bump stocks it’ll end there but the gun grabbers will never end their relentless pursuit to disarm every last person in this country. Then the only people that will have firearms will be the privileged, the elite and criminals. Look at what’s happening in Massachusetts and Washington State, citizens there have to turn in their bump stocks to law enforcement without compensation or they face criminal prosecution just for mere possession of an accessory. If future legislation is made law in Washington State citizens who own bump stocks there are made automatic felons with no recourse for owning something that was completely legal before. I’ll support Gun Owners of America (GOA) instead.

      1. You’re right and you’re wrong. Here’s why. As much as I complain about the NRA I remain a member so I can vote and change it from the inside. We can do this, one Board Member at a time. I don’t give them one cent more than my membership dues, everything else goes in the trash.

        I do belong to my State grassroots organization and support them. I do write my elected officials, make phone calls and do whatever I can to let them know they work for me not the other way around.

        Until recently, when health and distance now keep me from it, I attended Lobby Day every year in our State’s Capital. Small things line hosting open carry lunches, if your State allows it, to show the public that gun owners are just regular folks go a long way. We hosted an open carry dinner one night at an upscale restaurant, we had more than 30 people attend. One of the other patrons asked a waiter if we were all police officers. He replied “no, madam, they’re here for your protection”! He told us as we were leaving, it made our night.

        These are just things that most folks don’t even think of.

        1. @I live in Canada and would be more than happy if there was any chance in hell of obtaining any kind of carry permit at all.
          I AM 100% in favor of responsible gun ownership.
          No matter where you are the biggest problem is still thorough background checks to help keep firearms out of the hands criminals.

    21. Not all gun owners will vote the same, nor should they. There’s far more on the ballot than firearms. And sometimes the GOP puts up a candidate few folks would vote for.

      1. @LB, That is so incorrect. All gun owners should vote for pro-Second Amendment Civil Rights candidates. If we can get back to the Constitution on bearing arms, we will also get back to the Constitution on the First Amendment, the Fourth Amendment, the Tenth Amendment, and all the rest. Then we can force the S.Ct to do what they are Constitutionally empowered to do and stop doing what they are not Constitutionally empowered to do. And we can force Congress to do their job, rather than letting mere agencies make regulations “with the force and effect of law.”

        1. Wild Bill, I agree with you on almost everything but LB’s comment is correct. I abstained from voting when Romney ran because his ideology was WAY too far away from my personal belief structure. Politically he represented about 30% of my politics as well. To me it was a no-brainer not to vote as I refused to give Obama my vote. The GOP has had a habit of throwing institutionalized yes men forward as their candidate and supporting establishment RHINO’s over new blood that would actually be good or the party. They pushed extremely hard against Trump until it was evident their golden boys were not going to make it, and we have establishment RHINO’s in congress obstructing him. I have been drawn more and !ore towards the Libertarian party based on my ideology and beliefs though they have yet to put forth a candidate worth a damn besides Rand Paul.

          I believe we should continue to vote the issues of reinstating constitutional rule, supporting all rights above laws, and draining the swamp on both sides instead of entrenched bobbing heads only doing party business. Sometime this is a GOP candidate but often times it is neither. Then what is one to do? The answer isn’t always party loyalty.

          1. By not voting for Romney you effectively gave a vote to Obama. You said he only aligned with your views about 30% but I bet that was more than you aligned with Obama. Sometimes if you can’t vote for someone you need to vote against the other guy. Romney wasn’t great but he would have been better than Obama. Someone has to be elected and 30% of something is better than 100% of nothing when your talking about matching political views. Until there is a third party with the possibility of winning voting for them is the same as voting for the opposition.

            1. @Repo, @billy-bob

              No , by not voting for Romney, or McCain, or whoever else you want to toss in there, we did not give our vote to the opposing candidate.

              Just because we chose not to go along with and rubber stamp your stupidity does not mean we voted Obama. Just because someone shows a little more backbone and resists shuffling their feet along behind the moderate neo progressives in the central GOP does not make us traitors.

              I have news for you.

              You can drink beer with 4% alcohol by volume, or you can drink beer with 10%. You still end up drunk, the only question is how quickly.

              You can drive a car off a cliff at 30 miles per hour, or you can do it a 100 miles per hour. The car still ends up going over the cliff.

              You can vote for a “This guy can win” wishy washy progressive republican, or you can vote Communist Democrat. You still end up with socialism and violations of the Constitution.

              Stop blaming people who have backbones for your lack thereof.

            2. @revelator. I agree that in an electoral college your individual vote counts very little if you live in a blue state and you vote red. I some cases the popular vote does matter. If the election was close or when there is a tie some states use the popular vote to break it. Also if more people who think like you actually voted for a candidate who actually had a chance of winning hillary wouldn’t be able to say she won the popular vote. When the election is close you can tell by the polls if the third party candidate has a chance in hell of winning. Voting for someone who may get 5% of the vote does not give you a backbone or make you courageous. I will always vote for a person who aligns with my views even In the smallest amount because thats better than voting for the person who is 100% opposite my views. 10 or 20% of something is better than 100% of nothing. Every vote not cast for that candidate fails to negate a vote for the worse candidate. In most cases because of the electoral college your right it doesn’t make a difference unless it comes down to a tie or a very close election. But at the same time your third party protest vote does nothing but make you feel good. Someone has to win and when you know the 3rd party has no chance in hell it’s a wasted vote. Someone has to win and when you know it’s going to come down to the 2 major party candidates I want my vote either for one or against the other. Once we get support from the masses then it make sense to vote for a 3rd party but you know ahead of time if they have a chance and if it’s a wasted vote or not. Sometimes you have to vote against a horrible candidate (obama,hillary) or vote for a candidate that sucks less (romney,mccain,trump) atleast some of their views align with mine like 2nd amendment,lower taxes,smaller govt. I know if I get a Democrat I’m not going to agree with much if anything they do.

            3. @Repo

              “Voting for someone who may get 5% of the vote does not give you a backbone or make you courageous.”

              Interesting choice of words, but you miss the point. What makes it courageous is having the backbone to stand up to your own side, not just the people you know will automatically agree with you.

              Look at what you did to Rob J. “Boy! You just voted for Hillary and Obama since you didn’t shut up and vote for my guy!” Your first action to his standing up and saying he couldn’t vote for going over the cliff at 30 miles per hour, or 100 miles per hour was to effectively belittle and label him as a traitor.

              See, its not individuals like Rob J or myself who are sheep. We don’t just trudge our feet and say ok to a left wing progressive just because he puts an R in front of his name on the ballot, and yes I completely understand why that makes you upset. Here are two guys standing up and saying “we don’t have to go along with your bs just because you are whining and crying saying ‘But this is the guy who can win’ while trying to force him down our necks.”

              See, That is courage, that is backbone. That is having the guts to look a superior force of Germans demanding your surrender in the eye and reply “Nuts!” when you are almost out of ammo.

              What you look at as a wasted vote, that’s just you being upset that somebody had the balls to stand up and say “This isn’t right.” when you were just going along like a good obedient little boy and leaving you behind to defend your choice. The truly sad part is that I feel sorry for you. Not only have you fastened the chains of your own slavery around you, while you are complaining of us “Stealing” 5% of the vote away from your candidate, you have completely forgotten that 3% changed the world. Ego sum magister ferere mei.

              You owe Rob J an apology, though I doubt he will ever hear it from you.

            4. @revelator. No matter how you justify it,no matter what names you call me it’s still a wated vote when you know it’s going to come down to 2 candidates. It’s like saying team A and B are playing in the superbowl but since I don’t like them I’m betting on team C. All your Going to do is lose your money. I hate the 2 party system we are stuck with but I want as much say over who I s going to be elected as the current system gives me. I’m stuck in a blue state so I could just as easy cop out and say my vote won’t count because it’s going blue no matter what. But you never know when I could end up being close like florida did back in 2000. You never know when the popular vote might be important. It would have been nice if Hilary didn’t get to say she got more votes this past election.
              I don’t know if you only read part of my post or what but no where did I call rob j any names or a traitor. I actually said I agree and understand how his vote doesn’t count for much in a state like washington. So far you are the only one who has name called or made personal attacks. You know nothing about me except for the little I’ve said here. To compare yourself voting for a candidate with no chance of winning to WW2 soldiers fighting overwhelming odds against the Germans is an insult to their memory. You seem to think yourself a hero because you voted for a candidate with no chance of winning. You have an awful big opinion of yourself. If anyone should be apologizing it should be you. People always start name calling when their argument doesn’t hold up.
              I don’t vote for someone just because they have an R next to their name it just happens the ones who I have more in common with and have a chance of winning are Republican. Once a third party candidate is running that I agree with and can atleast be competitive I would vote for them. Still waiting to see a worthwhile third party candidate run then we can talk about them being competitive.

            5. @Repo

              Here lies the problem. YOU are the one feeding the two party system giving us the choice between a bad, and a worse candidate. If you want to know who wastes votes, look in the mirror. Perhaps if every person who feels like you do, at least if you may be telling the truth about only being forced to vote for a bad choice, were to dump the party and vote for a constitutionalist, do you think the Progressives controlling the republican party would have a chance? No, they would go the way of the Whigs. Imagine, we could elect Trey Gowdy and Mike Lee clones all over the country. As far as you owing Rob J an apology and what you did, allow me to enlighten you since your memory does not appear to be your strong suit.

              Your Rebuttal attempt to my claim.
              “I don’t know if you only read part of my post or what but no where did I call rob j any names or a traitor. ”
              “People always start name calling when their argument doesn’t hold up.”

              Your comment made to Rob J
              “By not voting for Romney you effectively gave a vote to Obama”

              Again this was you being triggered because, as you admit Romney wasn’t a candidate people wanted to vote for. The difference between you and Rob J though, is he had balls enough to stand up and say “You idiots wanted this progressive, you vote for him without me.”

              Hmmm, Insult to memory huh? So saying that we as Americans should all have the kind of attitude showed at Bastogne is an insult to their memory? Tell me, who do you really think General Anthony McAuliffe would look at with contempt if he were here today? Someone standing up and saying they refuse to go along with a bad choice even though their friends are berating them for it? Or do you think it would be for the people saying “It’s too hard! We might lose this time! Why won’t you just give in and join us?” Yeah, tell me which person he would Patton slap.

              I’m going to share a little information with you that is going to scare you. I don’t live in a Blue state like you where I can afford to sit in a corner and whimper about things are unfair for me but I’ll go along with it until someone stronger creates something I can move to.

              I live in a swing state. One that commonly gets called on as a major part of every single Presidential election year. And I am actively working to teach and embolden others to start reforming or burying the GOP by using their feet. If you want our votes to count alongside yours, then start voting for different candidates! Next time we have a Primary, how about you help Nominate a candidate who is 99% aligned with us instead of 30%? Stop whining and crying about trying to “Get the moderate, spineless, neutered shamwow that can win”, and start trying to put a hardline conservative constitutionalist up to vote. I’ll back a guy like that 100%. Until then, You may end up taking losses. You see, I don’t care if the Republican party takes a big smack to the mouth. Right now, with idiots like Ryan and McConnell, they need a good smack to bring them back to their base. If that means sitting back and smiling while listening to a bunch of weaklings cry and wail about how we lost, oh well.

              Now given your approach, I get the feeling that you have not read much in the way of Doug Giles. He’s got a couple of books out that would benefit you greatly. Even has a catchy little name for guys that don’t stand tall the way they should, but allow themselves to be cowed into just going along to get along. To say I don’t know much about you? I’d say I know enough. That’s the difference between the Sheepdog and the Sheep. You’ve already shown just what your character is already.

            6. @ Repo

              To borrow a line from yourself, Funny how when people don’t have an argument or a case they tend to say “You are boring and not worth my time” as a snub to someone they cant engage with intellectually. On a psychological level, the root cause is a need to express vindication in front of others as a means of moral superiority due to low self esteem since the individual finds it impossible to simply stop replying. Like I said, I know enough of who and what you are to play you like a fiddle.

              The problem I had was not that you had a difference of opinion. It was that you complained to someone else that had a difference of opinion and accused them of Defacto “Voting for the opposition”, i.e. Obama. Translation, you told Rob J “You stupid idiot, standing on your principles means Obama got one more vote than the guy I wanted to win and we got stuck with him because of people like you.”

              In other words, you can try to pass yourself off as morally superior and above name calling, but the hypocrisy and duplicity is still there. You attacked someone for having a difference of opinion and voicing it. Your actions do not match your words.

              Now, here is the fun part. Since you have failed to figure it out, I don’t particularly care what others opinion of myself is. What I do care about is exposing hypocrisy, both veiled and blatant. At times, that means setting up a long detailed trap and allowing someone to walk headlong into it based on their opinion, thereby destroying their opinion in the process. Other times it calls for much quicker manipulation due to time sensitive cases. One of the tactics used in this kind of situation, and ironically what I just did to you is Over Dramatization. Making a point exceedingly obnoxious as you manipulate the other individual into offering more and more ammunition to use against their own argument because their guard naturally lowers believing their opponent to be an idiot. Now, if you have had a conversation with me before, then that means you have gone through a name change. I still operate under my original handle.

              The point that you have entirely missed as such is that YOU do indeed have the right to make your own opinions and choices., but other people have the same right. Whether or not you choose one slice of bread, or two, at the end of the day you are still eating a crap sandwich. What I have been saying from the start is stop attacking the people who choose to see the stupidity in that and instead choose to go next door and order a ribeye.

              In regards to the veiled threat of violence you made…
              “The internet is probably the only place you do this because most people that act like you in real life end up carrying their teeth home in their pocket.”

              Yeah, I haven’t run into anyone with balls enough to do it, since the only people who get this side of my personality going are the Garritroopers of society.

              Have a pleasant evening.

            7. Hopefully WA will have enough support this coming election to turn back red, but it is doubtful. In the hopes of ousting Patty Murray from her quarter century in the Senate, I would probably vote for the devil himself to get rid of her. I am not adverse to voting the lesser of two evils, have done so in the past, but in the instance of Romney vs Obama they were both equally evil in my eyes.

              The problem with third party weakness is partially due to the candidates offered and partially due to the rigged system currently in place. Keeping a candidate from debate based upon their not meeting an approval rating created by the media is self supporting bias. In the eyes of the media third party candidates get little media attention and exposure, therefore they do not deserve media attention and exposure. For this reason, and many others, we will have an extremely hard time getting a third party POTUS elected in my lifetime. This is a travesty because our system desperately needs a third, even a fourth, party to alleviate gridlock and partisan politics.

              That all said, I neither ask for nor desire an apology, as I would neither offer nor concede to giving one, over a difference of opinion. If you two choose to continue with this, feel free to use my words to support either argument. I have to say it has been quite an interesting read.

            8. @Rob J

              I wish you the best of luck in that regard then sir. This little article has been little more than an experiment for me since I was alerted to a recent issue revolving around two articles centered on Marion Hammer, and the fact that one of the old guard here made aware that the second one asked for no debate or open comment on the material in the article.

              As for apologies given to you, that is your prerogative. I believe in and support always the individual right to vote according to your conscience, the same as Repo has. I do however continue to call out hypocrisy and blatant stupidity for both friend and foe. I trust and hope that will never be necessary with you.

              Remain always vigilant, and unbowed.

            1. @LB, If, by he, you mean Barry Soetoro (also known as Barak Obama) he is half British East African. There was no Kenya at the time of his birth. And “birther” is baby talk. Drop the baby talk.

            2. @ Wild Bill

              Actually, contrary to billy-bob and other hashtag commandos pushing the “Birther” or “Kenyan” line, or however you choose to word it…. Its wrong.

              Anyone who does some in depth research will find that BHO was in fact a genuine US Citizen, all thanks to his mother attempting to engage in a sham marriage with his father as a means of subverting immigration law(Never mind the fact that he was married already when he also married BHO’s mother). He was born therefore according to law, to a single US Citizen, and would derive natural citizenship from his mother at birth at least as far as legal requirement and precedent go. The real question regarding any citizenship claims arises in did he ever renounce his citizenship while living outside of the country(particularly Indonesia and the laws for attending school there).

              But Conspiracy theories, like buffalo butt juice, draws flies.

              But now, onto the impetus of your comments to LB. To understand completely, if you voted at all in the last two presidential elections at all, you were effectually reduced to voting for trash. Didn’t matter what party, big two or otherwise, we got stuck with trash, and that goes for your candidate as well. Them’s the beans.

          2. I voted Libertarian in 2012 and 2016. Could not vote for the mainstream candidates for Pres so I went 3rd party. If more folks did, they’d scare the pants of Dems and Reps. So many said “Oh, they can’t win. You’re wasting your vote.” Of course they won’t win unless fewer vote for the 2 biggies that they seem to hate. My vote went for change.

            1. @LB, It is not a popularity contest, and it is not about who you like. Your nation and country come first. You should have voted for the one that was best for the American people.

            2. @ Wild Bill

              Allow me to translate LB’s words into a more direct language.

              He is stating his right to vote is HIS and HIS ALONE, and if his moral principles dictate that he cannot vote for the candidate that you wish him to, that is his right to not do so.

              So far, you have told him
              1. He must vote for the candidate you approve of even if 10 other things about that individual violate his conscience.

              2. His choice to vote third party is trash

              3. Since he didn’t vote for the candidate you felt was best, you claim he is betraying his “nation and country.”

              First of all, “Nation and Country”? Seems like one in the same, not to mention screaming out “SOCIALISM AND COMMUNISM”. Second, last time I checked Individual Rights are still a solid part of the Constitution and do not at any point require Wild Bill’s signed permission to exercise. Also, Last time I checked, when a person enters the Military, they swear allegiance to the Constitution, not the nation. You know, so in case a dictator who ever tried to mandate that people vote a certain way ever came to power and tried to scrap our founding documents………

              Now the last time we had this out, you were exposed for practicing hypocrisy when it came to the Constitution. What the heck is going on with you? You used to understand it, what changed?

              You might want to look at staying off ammoland for a while, or at least not commenting until you get this figured out. You really are getting a ton of things wrong buddy.

            3. Good for you! The only wasted vote is one that doesn’t reflect your conscience.
              Voting for the lesser of two evils will only perpetuate the status quo.

            4. @Rev, Yes, Barry is a USC by derivative citizenship through his USC mother, but he can also be a citizen of another country because the United States recognizes dual citizenship.

            5. @ Wild Bill

              BINGO. That is the first post you should have made in response, and highlights a major problem pertaining to our Constitution and the immigration issue.

              Dual Allegiances is definitely an issue that needs to be addressed. Excellent post, that is the old Wild Bill I am used to. Thumbs up buddy.

    22. You are spot on. If every legal gun owner stepped and voted we would not be in this dilemma now. We need constitutional judges in office who do not rewrite or water down constitutional rights. The only way to get that done is to deny liberal anti gun politicians from getting into office. If we don not do it then we are in real trouble.

    23. Support your State Level 2A organization. This isn’t a trickle down from National Level Organizations, they must be supported .

      Show up in your State Capitol, and not only on the one day of 2A speachifying . Call , email and visit the District offices of your State Legislators .

      I’m still enough of a sentimental apologist , I won’t yet urge people to leave the NRA. , but the bang for the buck is supporting grass roots independent 2A groups .

      I won’t tell people to not shoot . But simply shooting per se dosen’t do anything to protect your rights . The grass roots 2A groups in the Battleground states are just about all persuing lawsuits , and greatly need donations to defray legal fees and lawyer bills .

      For each range session , donate the cost of a box of ammo to one of the Battleground lawsuits .

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