Swat Team Takes Children from Home Because of “Potential Liability” ~ VIDEO

Opinion

Arizona -(Ammoland.com)- -On 26 February, 2019, the Chandler Police SWAT team raided a home where the children were sick. The parents had not committed any crime, nor was any child in any substantial danger. The raid itself created far more danger than the danger it was supposed to mitigate.

It was a perfect storm of the conflict of rights and the Nanny State, parental responsibility and bureaucratic fear of liability. In short, it resulted from the basic conflict in our society between those who insist on perfection, and reality. It shows how creeping tyranny is advancing in society.

Here is a summation of the events leading to the raid. The parents took a two-year-old child to the doctor on Monday, 25 February, 2019, because it had a fever of more than 100. Some accounts say it had a fever of 105. Others accounts are far less precise. It is not clear what the highest fever was. The doctor contacted other doctors, who recommended the child be taken to the emergency room. From azcentral.com:

The doctor contacted Banner physicians who recommended the child be “taken to the emergency room as soon as possible,” according to police records. The doctor told the mother that meningitis can be life-threatening and said the hospital would contact her when the mother arrived.

After they left the doctor's office, the child was laughing and playing with his siblings. The mother took the child’s temperature again. It was near normal.

Shortly after 6:30 p.m., the mother called the doctor and told her that her toddler no longer had a fever so she wasn’t taking him to the emergency room.

The mother also said she was worried about getting in trouble with DCS because her child did not have vaccinations.

You can see how the liability fears are stacking up. The child had a fever. Some doctors say it should be checked out at the emergency room. If anyone in the bureaucratic system allows the child to stay at home, they risk losing their career and everything else if the child is seriously injured or dies. On the other hand, if the physician calls the Department of Child Safety (DCS), his liability is gone. It is transferred to the bureaucracy. There is *no* risk to the doctor for transferring his liability to the state.

Swat Team Takes Children from Home Because of Potential Liability
Swat Team Takes Children from Home Because of Potential Liability

I talked to a former DCS caseworker. I was told that caseworkers do not generally make the decision to go to the police. That is done by a supervisor. So there is another step, and another stack in the liability fear pile, from someone more removed from the case. If the caseworker does not refer the case to a supervisor, they risk their job, everything, if the child dies. Then the supervisor faces the same risk. So they refer the case to the police. If, as in this case, the parents don't want everyone rousted out at 10:30 p.m. on Monday, after everyone is in bed, for what they see as a non-existent problem, the police ended up going with a SWAT team and forcing their way in at 1 a.m. on Tuesday.

All of this could be short-cut if the parents obeyed the orders of what the various people in the bureaucracy ordered them to do. But the parents had information the officials did not have, and they refused to do what appeared stupid and unnecessary to them. They exercised their parental authority and rights. They feared the DCS bureaucracy would take their children. Their fear appears to have been justified.

When the parents tried to assert their rights, the gloves come off and the police used force to make them comply. It could have been avoided if the police were willing to believe the parents. Liability bias worked against that outcome. If the police accepted the parent's word, and something bad happened to the child, the police would be in trouble.

40 years ago, before we moved into liability insanity, it was the parent's job to manage the risk. The parents are closest to the problem. If the child died, the liability would be on the parents, and it would mostly be criminal liability.

That approach worked very well in Western Civilization. We have far less child mortality (once the child is born) than we had a hundred years ago. Parents have enormous incentives to take care of their children. But, and this is important: we can never achieve perfection.

Those promoting the Nanny State demand perfection. It is their lever for more and more state power. They demand that no one ever get hurt. Proponents of state power, because of the utility to politicians of “it's for the children!” especially demand that children never be hurt. This works especially well with women voters, especially single women voters. It ignores the danger and hurt that is done by the state, and state procedures, to children. It moves more and more power into state hands.

Voting for something does not make it so.

Removing children from a home with intact biological parents often puts the children at risk at foster homes. My former DPS case worker source said they estimated the percentage of foster homes that appeared to be in the system primarily for the monetary rewards, at about 50%.

At each stage of the liability stack, the stack is biased toward state action and away from parental rights. Each official actor faces less liability from state action than they do from not taking state action.

Every step along the way is relatively small and incremental. The doctor called other doctors. They recommended a trip to the emergency room. When that did not happen, the doctor called the Department of Child Safety. DCS called the police. The police got a warrant. The police called out the SWAT team.

All of the state action is expensive. This is where the movement to state action fails. What the state does is orders of magnitude more expensive than what a parent does.

Contrary to what State promoters claim, resources are limited.

My former DCS source told me that caseworkers are enormously overburdened, because of the requirements of the bureaucracy. The government simply cannot afford to have caseworkers take the place of parents. Perhaps more clearly, all of society cannot afford to have the government take the place of parents.

This case is extraordinary and newsworthy because the parents' exercise of their parental rights collided with the state actors fears of liability, resulting in a dramatic video. The child was never in any real medical danger, making the state action appear harsh and unnecessary. In this case, it was harsh and unnecessary.

The case shows the power of recording police actions. A functioning recording system is as powerful, in some ways, at protecting your rights, as a firearm is. The father had a shotgun by his bed. In this case, the video recording was a far more powerful tool to protect his rights.

As a society, we must accept that resources are limited, that parents are fundamentally closer to children than the state can be. Preventing SWAT raids at 1 a.m. to check on a child will depend on changing the liability stack, so that a better balance of risk and liability exist.

It will mean accepting the idea that perfection is impossible, and risk is always a reality.

For example, if the parent says the child is not at risk, a notification of civil and criminal liability might be made to transfer the liability from doctors, DCS, and police to the parents. Virtually every official phone call is recorded. There is no additional cost to this approach. There may be a slight additional risk to children. There might be slightly less risk to children. It is impossible to know.

We face a similar problem with Second Amendment rights. Those promoting state control, for their own purposes, demand perfection. They demand zero risks, but ignore costs. They use the “its for the children!” argument to advance their agenda.

  • Voting for something does not make it so.
  • Perfection is not possible.
  • Resources are limited.

Acknowledging the reality of those three things goes a great way in defeating creeping tyranny.


About Dean Weingarten:

Dean Weingarten has been a peace officer, a military officer, was on the University of Wisconsin Pistol Team for four years, and was first certified to teach firearms safety in 1973. He taught the Arizona concealed carry course for fifteen years until the goal of constitutional carry was attained. He has degrees in meteorology and mining engineering, and recently retired from the Department of Defense after a 30-year career in Army Research, Development, Testing, and Evaluation.

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Pissed off
Guest
Pissed off

Are we sure that we killed Hitler in ww2 I believe he lives here still today

Oppressed
Guest
Oppressed

What I see happening is people will stop having children all together and society will die off ……governments own your ass lock stock and both barrels we are no longer free people in a free country it’s time to raze up and take back our lives.

Get Out
Guest
Get Out

Perhaps if the doctor came to the door instead the situation wouldn’t have become dangerous for every one involved. Instead a SWAT team kicks in the door in the wee hours of the morning, probably scared everyone in the home for no reason. The below statement identifies a lot like the ERPO’s being passed into law doesn’t it? They’re supposed to protect a persons 2nd Amendment Right but in fact strips away and denies many of our constitutional rights. This one is supposed to protect a persons Parental Rights but in fact strips away and denies many of their constitutional… Read more »

willy d
Guest
willy d

I thought that this used to be the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA , not the USSR, Germany (GESTAPO during W W II, or some THIRD WORLD DICTATORSHIP COUNTRY ???? This nonsense of busting down doors in the we hours of the morning is only asking for all kinds of shoot outs and casualties on private citizens and police, has everyone gone nuts in the court system, police departments, and society in general, Are they watching to many cop shows on T V about busting down doors to give the rush of Adrenalin to make it seem to be right? You… Read more »

Brent
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Brent

These parents are the reason I am highly offended by the oppression of the sane. The very Whitey God-Loving person that prefers using Christ as the answer is the enemy of liberals. Thing is, this Godly enemy-of-liberal White nationalist abelism is the reason the child still lives, and might be the ONLY reason in an Atheist environment. If the parents were schizophrenic or had another mental illness that the Liberal Agenda wants to shove down our throats video cameras would not have even be on any brain cells within a 5 mile radius. Possibly late for his meds, the voices… Read more »

Free Helicopter Rides For Commies
Guest
Free Helicopter Rides For Commies

Sh!t like this is what’s going to get a lot of cops, and also a lot of innocent people, killed. Sorry but when you look at the basic facts here, the government overstepped BIG TIME. But that doesn’t happen in my state, for now, because we have laws that provide for the lawful defense by force of arms against police who commit crimes – including the felony of deprivation of Rights under color of law – by lawfully armed private citizens. Police need to start reading their state and federal constitutions, with particular attention to the Bill of Rights, and… Read more »

Brent
Guest
Brent

The fact that the original family grabbed the video camera and not a gun triggers the shit out of the liberal. Basically by not resorting to violence and being the infidel sane person you left the army of the insane with blue balls an a reterograde ejaculation* when he blow his wad to satisfy his murder boner. The fact that you are sane and were not executed by the army of the insane basically sent the message to the Liberals…I am not going to buy into your death cult. If a ideology that glorifies sexual perversion, entitlement, and child sacrifice… Read more »

Jocko
Guest
Jocko

Let’s stop the rush to judgment, look at the facts of this case and it’s obvious the police were completely justified in what they were doing.

hoss
Guest
hoss

Let me ask you something; Did your parents have any children that lived?

GNewman
Guest
GNewman

Proof of afterbirth living.

Nicks87
Guest
Nicks87

LOL April fools!

Sapper04
Guest
Sapper04

I bet you are a good Marxist, you POG!

Rev Andrew
Guest
Rev Andrew

Assuming the story is actually factual, the use of SWAT team is outrageous.The overly aggressive police break down a door guns drawn for a report of a sick child makes no sense . There must be an untold part of the facts of this situation.
If it’s actually factual then we must address this with our elected officials before innocents are killed.

Taj
Guest
Taj

About half the crap I read on this page on a weekly basis is how no one trust the media to accurately report what is really going on out there. Everyone feels free to chime in when they think the media is spreading BS. Why is it some of you clowns choose to believe them now? Many of you(not all) pick and choose the BS you spread just like the media does. No one knows the real facts unless you were there from the start of this situation. I’m not going to comment on what the cops or the parents… Read more »

tomcat
Guest
tomcat

This two o’clock in the morning breaking down doors bull has to stop! There are few times this is necessary and it is done to add some excitement to the job and show the power and authority that a lot of cops have a strong desire for. The more this happens the more people are going to get shot, whether it be the home resident or the cops. People are going to arm themselves and protect themselves regardless who comes to the door at an hour when most people are sleeping.It may be necessary in the case of catching a… Read more »

Get Out
Guest
Get Out

The situation could have gotten out of hand so fast that someone could have been killed! If the doctor was so worried why didn’t he just make a follow up house call to check on the child again? Since the Chandler Police SWAT team was needed to kick in the door and remove the children by force, what were the child’s symptoms after being taken to the hospital? This is just like the ERPO’s being forced on the people with no clear intent of the ERPO’s purpose.

Brent
Guest
Brent

The liberal idealogy is that your ‘abelist sane privelege’ denied them the thrill of snuffing out a child’s life. Swat team has joined the chat: A child! Kill it! Kill it with fire before it lays eggs! Its white and sane! Kill it more! We hates it FOREVER! Parent has joined the chat: You are aware that your macho patriarchial role playing antics are being recorded for the civilized world to see. Imagine how stupid you will look in 50 years. Swat team: NOOOO! NOOO! We can’t kill anything! I’m gonna PRE… I’m gonna PRE… Child remains! This cannot be!… Read more »

Ken
Guest
Ken

Time to calm down and think. All we know is what was reported by the media. We know how reliable they are for factual reporting. I’m a retired LEO and probably more of a Constitutionalist than many readers here. I do not agree with actions I have seen some CPS employees take. In this case it appears they had reason to believe the child may have a contagious and potentially fatal illness. They notified law enforcement. Chandler PD did not rush out and assault the house, they presented the information they were given to a magistrate who determined that the… Read more »

TZAZ
Guest
TZAZ

You are missing the whole point of this story, a child’s well being and the concerns of a doctor are valid points, the danger of an overreaching nanny state is. The excess use of military style raids by police departments is likewise a disturbing trend.

MB
Guest
MB

SWAT team with guns drawn, breaking down the door, well I guess the Gestapo and KGB are alive and well in America. Parental rights, 1st, 2nd and 4th amendment rights violated, good job there CPD. Now wait to get your asses sued, and your careers gone. Enjoy. All they had to do is send a doctor to check on the status and make recommendation to parents. Imaging the trauma for the children in the home, they will never trust police or authorities ever again.

Brent
Guest
Brent

Making a criminal is like making a terrorist. Make the person you wish to incarcerate life so miserable that he feels that gangs and crime and bombs are the only way out. The recipe for a lone terrorist is for the invading country to bomb his civilian home and the invading country does nothing to help him and even is told that the invasion is liberating you…yes, liberating you from your oil. From the viewpoint of the person who’s wife and kids died was left homeless, the person dropping the bomb is the agressor.

JPM
Guest
JPM

Practically daily I see items in the media, or hear stories like this (if they are to be believed) that indicate how much we (the USA) has become more and more like the USSR we heard about in the 1960s where the citizens’ rights were non-existent and the government was the master. The fact that this took place at the local/state level in my state is even more disturbing.

Core
Guest
Core

This will be a stiff suit against the State and Civil suit: probably go to Supreme Court. I could imagine sending an officer over to check on the child, in a peaceful manner and asking if the child is okay. This entire team could have been wiped out if mom, dad, grandpa, grandma, uncle, was former military. The kids could have been killed. This kind of lunacy needs to be BS checked before LEO are warranted to enter.

LesWol
Guest
LesWol

Since most doctors do not make house calls why not send an NP or RN during normal waking hours? Either one could monitor vitals and decide if a doctor was needed. It would be a lot cheaper than a swat team and would offer a gold standard of pediatric care that would reassure many parents. The KISS principle comes back into focus … again.

Jack
Guest
Jack

Red Flag laws like the idiots in Colorado just passed will see lots of doors smashed open at 2:00 AM. G.Gordon Liddy years ago warned of the jack booted thugs with guns that will be invading homes. Velkom to AmeriKa komrad.citizen–obey! Unfortunately, soon the police will be our enemies because they will allow themselves to become that.

Will Flatt
Guest
Will Flatt

G. Gordon Liddy also wisely recommended that when people shoot in self-defense against the new USA GESTAPO, to aim above the ballistic vests and aim for their heads. All this could have been avoided with a more polite return to contact; a call from the doctor, a ‘house call’ in person by the doctor, or if no one could be contacted, a routine ‘wellness check’ by a patrol officer (NOT a whole freakin SWAT team!!) should have been the appropriate response!! This governmental heavyhandedness is going to cause people to open fire on the next gaggle of ‘jack booted thugs’… Read more »

Bill
Guest
Bill

There must be other facts or things not know that factored into this story. What resulted? Was thechild examined and found with feavercor no feaver?
Qere vaccinations legal requirement?
Why did the doctor think there could be meningitis? We’re there other symptoms beside a feaver? What were they?
Incomplete facts do not give a proper bases for proper conclusions.

CJ
Guest
CJ

All of the facts isn’t the point, but this story matches most if what I have read from the lawyer’s statement. Children in the U.S. and Canada can be removed from their parents for things as simple as not having dental work or dental cleanings done in ‘a reasonable period of time’ when a dentist files a neglect charge. Not many know this, but those who do know about it are obviously worried. That’s why the Mom knew to ask whether there would be any issues arising from her making her own decision. It’s too far-reaching. Parents are losing their… Read more »

freewill
Guest
freewill

Makes no difference, Government took control and took the kids from the parents, if you cant see the danger, then boy are you in for a shock when phase two comes into to play!!

Brent
Guest
Brent

Old rules. If you drive drunk consider yourself lucky if it was the cop that stopped you…rather than the large oak tree down the street.

New rules. If the government raids enemy houses they can consider themselves lucky if it’s a video camera that shot you…rather than a shotgun.

Both rules. Play a stupid game, win a stupid prize.

Note to aboriginal types. tide pods are not food.

MacofJack
Guest
MacofJack

I wonder how long it will take the police to realize that they are just a political pawn and the IDIOT liberals don’t care if they get them killed or not?

Clifffalling
Guest
Clifffalling

Couple thoughts, in my experience, everyone jumps when an MD gets in the mix and starts barking orders. MDs need to be taken down a notch in this country. (Overgeneralized statement here) Valuable skills, yes. Miracle performing, mystical magicians, not so much. Second, we don’t know the history on this family. Dean mentioned the mother expressed concern over DCS. IMO that leads me to believe she has had contact with DCS prior. I know Maricopa runs things differently, but up north in Coco, DCS appears to be in CYA mode since the scandal that changed their name. It appears to… Read more »

Garandpa
Guest
Garandpa

This writer is wrong on so many levels. The “Naturopath” (not a doctor) is not liable if the parents refuse medical advice, so that theory of why CPS was called is incorrect. But from his perspective: He is presented with an unvaccinated child, showing symptoms of a potentially fatal disease, in a household with other susceptible children and the parents refuse to verify with real doctors whether the child is sick and contagious. That is justification for CPS intervention. Then they refused a police request to verify the child’s welfare multiple times and the police got a court order to… Read more »

MamaBear
Guest
MamaBear

I agree!

Lurch
Guest
Lurch

SWAT my got have been used because of previous run-ins with law enforcement which indicated a normal police welfare check might have been met with violence

Tionico
Guest
Tionico

but the Mom had rechecked the child’s temperature and it was near normal, greatly reduced from her earlier check that led to the doctor visit. Meningitis is a bacerial infection, fever being part of it. When a bacterial infection causes a fever, and the fever breaks, it is a clear sign that the body’s natural resources have dealt with the infection and the danger has passed. This is not her first child, and most good Moms know their children far better than any doctors do. WHY IS IT that gummit is so quik to determine that they who are closest… Read more »

Brent
Guest
Brent

I have both those albums. If illegals voted Republican Hilary’s last big hit would be The Wall.

Mike
Guest
Mike

Patriots in the district need to show up on the Chandler Mayor’s front lawn at 0200 some morning to protest the action. Loudly and with the media. Maybe the Doctor ‘s house too. And if nothing else, the family needs to sue everyone involved. This is subjugation.

hippybiker
Guest
hippybiker

“Imagine the future. A jackboot on your face, forever!”
Eric Blair aka: Goerge Orwell

RotaryConnected
Guest
RotaryConnected

“We are from the government. We are here to help you”.

Hoplite
Guest
Hoplite

Some day they will be held accountable. It was proven and accepted at Nuremburg that “I was just following orders” is not a legitimate reason for doing something heinous.

Clark Kent
Guest
Clark Kent

Quick, Dean! Go to Chandler pronto and present yourself as a witness since you know all about what happened! I am sure the police, parents and district attorney are all eagerly waiting your arrival! GO!

ras
Guest
ras

Clark Kent= sarcastic know it all.

Clark Kent
Guest
Clark Kent

ras = ignorant dolt.

Vanns40
Guest
Vanns40

Since you appear to disagree please give us the real scoop. Oh, you don’t know? Does that mean you’re just trolling……AGAIN?

Clark Kent
Guest
Clark Kent

Vanns40: I don’t know the real scoop. Neither does the author; although he pretends to. Do you work full time at being a putz?

m.
Guest
m.

imagine the response to a “mis-gendering” or other felonious action like carving a pop-tart-gun or having an expended .22 casing in your pocket

Brent
Guest
Brent

Pink Floyd was right, we don’t need no infestation. The liberals want to exterminate the genes for sanity. A violent psycopathic population would be more easily sold on the idea that more government control is there to protect them. Sanity saves lives. Sanity is not a crime. Political inconvenience should not be a capital offense. Labels are for clothes.

Green Mtn. Boy
Guest
Green Mtn. Boy

This is part and parcel with the state and the need to control,the Fascist Taliban demands control of every facet of life when Constitutionally it is forbidden.

m.
Guest
m.

…obey bureaucrats, the last thing to do if you value your freedom & safety. these a**holes will do anything.

m.
Guest
m.

red-flag “health” department laws to the rescue. what i’d expect from the sin-ema-brand voters. good luck to the potg-patriots left in az.

Nanashi
Guest
Nanashi

As far as I can tell the Congressman for that area is Andy Biggs, a Republican.

m.
Guest
m.

thnx N, not surprised at all.

m.
Guest
m.

i’m not a dhimmi-rat:
.a republi-can’t, like a repli-cant, but with longer life span?
.imagine how things might be if a tyrell-type corporation held a monopoly on the production of politicians with 4-year life spans.