U.S.A. –-(Ammoland.com)- Those in the gun culture can recognize the run on toilet paper as similar to the .22 ammunition bubble we experienced in President Obama’s second term.
Toilet paper, like .22 ammunition, takes very specialized machinery to produce in bulk at historically low prices. People became accustomed to it being plentiful, cheap, and easily available. Capital investment has been tuned by the market to meet the demand. There is only a small surplus capacity.
.22 Ammunition
Then, an event, unexpected by most, happened. People worried if they would have enough; with .22 ammunition, people who had been satisfied with 50 rounds wanted a thousand; the number of people who wanted much more than usual cleared out the .22 ammunition shelves in short order.
Small scale entrepreneurs bought all they could in bulk, and peddled the product for 5-10 times what they purchased it for, on the Internet. This caused severe shortages for those who kept only a small amount on hand.
We see the same thing happening with toilet paper. People are concerned they will be caught at home without it. The shelves have been cleared. The manufacturers are running their machines on three shifts, 24 hours a day. From cnn.com:
They’re faced with tradeoffs. Many were already operating their manufacturing facilities 24/7 prior to the pandemic. Now, some are limiting their facilities to essential workers and contractors. It’s unclear, however, what they will do in the event that those workers get sick.
“If you ask me why everyone is grabbing toilet paper, I can’t really explain it,” said Tom Sellars, CEO of Sellars Absorbent Materials in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. His company is a processor and converter of paper and related products. “It’s not like we are suddenly using more of it. But the surge in demand could strain the supply chain,” he said.
Toilet paper use is less elastic than the use of .22 rimfire ammunition. Both commodities can be stored for years without much of a problem.
There are substitutes for both. Airguns and pellets became more popular during the .22 bubble. Bidets are likely to see an upsurge during the Chinese virus panic.
Those who preached the wisdom of being prepared are mostly unconcerned. If you have studied panics and societal problems historically, you see toilet paper is one of the things that is in demand. Having six months supply on hand takes a small amount of space.
Those who panic purchased will not need to purchase for a while. Neighbors will lend a roll or two to help out those who have been caught short.
It is unlikely prices will escalate as much as it did for .22 ammunition.
Washcloths and hand washing are available to all.
A helpful hint: Do not try to flush ordinary paper or newsprint down the commode. It was not designed to disintegrate in water and may plug up the works. If you must use such substitutes, dispose of them separately, as you would disposable diapers.
Our superb public sanitation system is not at risk (not so sure about California, where public sanitation does not seem as much of a concern). The electric grid is not compromised. There is plenty of clean water in the public supply system. We have an abundance of food.
Those who live in rural areas are less at risk.
Toilet paper factories will continue to run 24/7. Supply will eventually meet demand. There is no incentive to purchase more industrial plants to make toilet paper. People working outdoors to harvest the wood fiber needed for production are not at much risk.
Unlike .22 ammunition, there is no reason to believe the base demand for toilet paper has increased. Private industry increased production to meet the demand for more .22 ammunition, but another run on ammunition is underway. I expect it to be shorter.
Many retailers are saying they are emptying their shelves.
If you stocked up after the .22 ammunition bubble deflated, you did the right thing. The latest panics will subside, probably much quicker than the .22 bubble did in the last decade.
Toilet paper will last for a decade or more. .22 ammunition is good for 50 years or more.
It is a good thing to be prepared.
About Dean Weingarten:
Dean Weingarten has been a peace officer, a military officer, was on the University of Wisconsin Pistol Team for four years, and was first certified to teach firearms safety in 1973. He taught the Arizona concealed carry course for fifteen years until the goal of Constitutional Carry was attained. He has degrees in meteorology and mining engineering, and retired from the Department of Defense after a 30 year career in Army Research, Development, Testing, and Evaluation.
I guess that is one way to put what happened: “Small scale entrepreneurs bought all they could in bulk, and peddled the product for 5-10 times what they purchased it for, on the Internet.” Now, I have purchased a little over 11,000 rounds of 22lr between last November and last month. I am not selling any of it; for cost or at a scalper’s rate. I currently have over 25,000 on hand because that’s what I want and I can afford it. My purchases were ordered from large ammo businesses and did not affect anyone else’s ability to get a… Read more »
Glad to hear you are perfect. Now work on some humility.
I think you are less Superman and more a simp.
Supersimp?? 🙂
“super” carries connotations of ‘good” “desirable”.
How bout minisimp. Or smallsimp perhaps microsimp.
How about “simpleTON”? As in: 2000 pounds of simpleton. 🙂
Coming from you, the ultimate putz.
perhaps the discussion would improve if you would refrain from the insults and lead by example instead of following his example
Why don’t you go hang out with your friends Rev. You know, like the guy found with the wannabe Florida Gov candidate the other day.
Perhaps you should leave the USA and do us all a favor. Buh-bye! You won’t be missed.
Always with the negative attitude, cluck!
Since when is humility a negative?
Sup, well you certainly are not perfect. Not only the issue with Kryptonite, but also issues with logic, facts, and reality, hence your posting as Superman. Unless you are Adonis Stevenson in real life, we can be quite certain “Superman” is not a fitting pseudonym for you.
Never claimed to be perfect. And you would not recognize logic, facts or reality if it bit you in your fat azz.
@RoyD
I’m a big fan of 17hmr for rimfire think its a great caliber in comparison to .22lr but I’m glad you are stocked up I am stocked on 17hmr in case you know the squirrel zombie apocalypse comes.
gcm: I put myself out there just as an example. Until Wal-Mart decided to have a fire sale last December I had not purchased a single factory centerfire round of ammo since 1980. As a handloader since 1968 I load all the centerfire ammo I use. And I have built up a fair sized “stash” because it is less expensive and I can load just what I want and I enjoy doing it. But this “panic” is also affecting powder supplies which were already under pressure for various reasons. Not to worry, I have plenty. I bought 1000 40 Cal… Read more »
I also reload everything my son and I shoot but, like you, I also take advantage of sales when applicable. When Gander Outdoors closed out their ammo the 9mm and 45 got down into reload cost so I carried out quite a stash. Auction sales can be beneficial too! But there are a ton of people that don’t know their costs and pay above retail for ammo. It’s fun to watch them go crazy! I’ve been reloading through the winter and now just continuing to kill time. Plenty of time, beer, powder, primers, and bullets! Not a bad way to… Read more »
This was sent out by one of the places where I have bought a lot of bullets and cases over the last few years: RMRbullets Sat, Mar 21 at 10:33 AM READ THIS BEFORE ORDERING. PLEASE!!!! Hey, I just wanted to send a quick update as to what is going on at RMR. First off, THANK YOU so much for all the orders. In one week’s time, we have gotten more orders than we usually see in two months. Obviously, it was impossible to plan for this stuff. So, we are doing our best to ship your orders as soon… Read more »
Roy have you ever used Everglades Ammo? They always have pretty good prices and free shipping. Another site is US Reloading services out of Florida. I’ve used RMR in the past also.
Gindy: Yes I have ordered from them several times in the past and they also treat their customers right. By the way, Fedex just delivered the bullets I ordered from Rose Dist on Wednesday this week.
Confession Time: How can you reload all this ammo without empty cases? You are either buying unfired brass, once fired brass, or most reasonably, cost-wise, inexpensive fresh ammo. the simple fact is there is minimal if any cost savings in reloading.
Well Rev, you have shown yourself to be a small minded person. How much pistol brass do you think I might have on hand if I gathered, sorted, cleaned, and stored brass at a rate of 100 lbs a week for a period of two years? Now not every week was that much but most of them were. I’ll tell you this, I know I sold well over 30,000 9mm cases after Sandy Hook along with thousands of 38, 45, and 40 S&W cases. I still have five gallon buckets in the garage with brass that I haven’t looked at… Read more »
@RoyD, This fellow has written some disrespectful blurbs else where, and he does not write like reverends that I know. I am starting to suspect him.
@OV and Will, Boy howdy, has he come to the wrong place.
I’m also getting that vibe. That Scottrev won’t be around here for long…
For those that feel they have to or should know, I ordered 2000 pieces of primed 40 S&W brass today. Now why would I do that since I have 1000 sized, and flared and polished of the same brand ready to be primed. Well that 1000 is already committed to load during the following week. And since I have found that this particular brand of brass is the strongest available in 40 S&W and 9mm, and 10mm, and 44Mag it is what I use for my JHP loads in those calibers. What brand is that you ask, sorry, that is… Read more »
@RoyD — Word: my hope is that you have all that ammo stored in fireproof cases. My neighbor didn’t, and his place caught fire in 2003. The firefighters could do nothing to combat the flames because they, like everyone else, were busy taking cover. He had so much ammo stored out in the open, that bullets were going off for a solid twenty minutes. They were still kicking off long after the fire burned everything to the ground. Both his dogs died in that fire that could have been saved, if only he stored all that ammo properly. I share… Read more »
Except for a Molotov cocktail through the window while I’m not here I think we’ll be ok.
Them things scare the shit out of anybody.
The scalping of .22 ammo is a thing of the past, over a decade and a half in the past, during the Obozo admin to be precise. The good thing that happened because of it, is more Americans were introduced to ammo of greater accuracy as they were forced to use target ammo for hunting.
Let’s see, a decade and a half ago would be 2005. I am pretty sure George Junior was President until Dec 31, 2008. Keep it up dumbass. Bring on some more of your moronic postings. You are my new plaything. And, yes, I am easily amused.
@RoyD, I don’t believe that this fellow’s corn bread is done in the middle.
Higher ballistic coefficients for better accuracy? Obomba was President 15 years ago? (I don’t think he knows what a decade is)
And most comic of all: Scalping is over!
Yup, people will never sell at a profit ever again! The black and grey markets are a thing of the past. I guess prostitution is also gone, at least in his powered by unicorn farts world…
Still pretty squishy in the gray matter, that’s for sure.
@Roy – People like you have indeed impacted the current shortages. You and others raised demand over an extended period. Because manufacturers adjust production rates to match demand, your shopping history has likely increased current supply.
@wjd, You do not have a what? That is blaspheme!
I like your view as it is probably correct, but the effect is most likely very, very, small in the grand scheme of things.
Want to Trade: Have a new unopened 4-roll package of bathroom tissue….single ply….Great Value brand. Will consider trading for like condition NIB Barrett M107A1 .50BMG. Replies including Nightforce ATACR 7-35×56 scope and over 100 rounds 750gr Hornady AMAX ammo will receive extra consideration. Only Titanium Grey models need respond. PM me.
@Always pro 2A – Damn you are even greedier than I.
I’ve got an 8 roll pack, double ply, northern (I think). Minimum bid 1k 9mm HST. Offers for loose rolls will also be considered.
@StL, Most humorous.
You guys are all way worse off than I. Most I could get right now for 2 rolls of genuine Scotts 1000 sheet is 500 rounds of Tulammo steel cased.
@USA That is certainly an imaginative proactive and tasty solution. When life gives you lemons and all that. Reminds me of a former boss who was trapper in Europe when Iceland volcano impacted air travel. News was full of stories about people stuck in airports, meanwhile he and his wife extended vacation to multiple additional countries and he sold a few new European clients to boot. Never understand tendency some have to fall apart in face of adversity – well OK, some initial downtime is understandable but then move on and make the best of it. In poker terms –… Read more »
I stocked up on .22lr when it became available and I have a stock pile of TP that should last a month! Live and learn!
“If you ask me why everyone is grabbing toilet paper, I can’t really explain it,” Well I CAn explainit. Some dweeb on the TeeVee set, desparate for more words to fill the void on the coming “pandemic” nothingburger declared that everyone should “buy toilet paper, bottled water, and canned beans”. I had heard this from somewhere, it was, as ever, endlessly repeated on the snooze… but I paid it no mind until I was in our local huge supermarket (which I like a WHOLE lot better than Costco or any of the other nationwide big box chains) late Sunday evening.… Read more »
the real reason for the run on TP: Every time they hear someone sneeze they crap their pants!
This is what a real “Zombie Apocalypse” looks like. When fear strikes a populace and they lose sight of any and all reason, first they panic, and then eventually they revert to base human nature. As supplies run low, mobs form with a mentality of “Us vs Them” (Mayors pass confiscation orders for this reason). As the situation continues to devolve, the abstinence from direct violence disappears as the Us vs Them turns to preying on those who can be outnumbered. It is in situations like this where a right to self defense and the bearing of arms is so… Read more »
@Rev, Good to have you back! Just more reasons to flee the cities.
@Wild Bill
Thanks. Work has flipped and flopped me around on hours the last couple weeks. I’m still around, but having to cope with life. Seeing what is going on isn’t helping either.
““Men, it has been well said, think in herds; it will be seen that they go mad in herds, while they only recover their senses slowly, one by one.”
― Charles MacKay,
The Run on TP is Baffling for a Respiratory Virus, so I’m Guessing that the Next Time Cholera Hits We will see a Run on Nasal Spray!
@JF, the lack of N95 masks was baffling to, until the L.A. Times ratted Obama off: “Los Angeles Times and Bloomberg News: Federal stockpile of N95 masks was depleted under Obama and never restocked by Emma Colton | March 23, 2020 10:23 AM The national shortage of N95 respirator masks can be traced back to 2009 after the H1N1 swine flu pandemic, when the Obama administration was advised to replenish a national stockpile but did not, according to reports from Bloomberg News and the Los Angeles Times. The Trump administration is scrambling to replenish a stockpile of protective medical gear… Read more »
Probably dug in deeper than an Arkansas tick, cocked, unlocked and ready to rock
I think that was Dave in Fairfax about his sneak & peek breakin. USA just went poof. And he is right outside the Denver containment zone, which just went into full emergency lockdown. So the way I figure it, either he got caught up in that, he dropped out and dug in, or he’s prowling the containment line looking for truth, justice, and fun. My money is on the latter. 🙂
USA, out prowlin’ and growlin’! Remember, I called it first! 🙂
I also. I’ve been waiting twenty years for the black swan. I’ll be damned if I’m not gonna go see it for myself.
Exactly! Some of the old timers from 40 years ago are coming off “All Sage now.”
USA, what’s really spooky, is the compliance people are exhibiting. This is the fascist takeover those folk warned us about. Consider this (you proly already did), for future more astringent measures, the government will have already read the license plates of the non-compliant. Next time they will be taken out before the big one! Not only that. They want to send a check to everyone. Besides the obvious, it gives them the ability to track money flow and tailor corporate sweetheart laws to favor them over small businesses. Just look at the Bill of Attainders being signed against gun sellers… Read more »
https://www.alt-market.com/index.php/articles/4165-the-grasshoppers-are-swarming-mad-that-you-are-prepared-for-the-crash
Yup, the swarm is angry. Fer sure. 🙂
@OV I noticed that, too. Many of his comments are erased, as well, so the strings don’t make sense. Or maybe his computer’s battery is discharged.
I could use some more .22LR but I’ve just about run out of room for anything more. See y’all at the barricades.
“Stand your ground, don’t fire unless fired upon, but if they mean to have a war, let it begin here.”
What happen to don’t fire until you see the whites of their eyes!
@AmPat, We have scopes, now!
So Will, since I apparently missed it, what got some of your posts removed from this thread?
you cant see their eyes when they are shaking their arses at you in blatant contempt of freedom!
Rev, No, but you can “dot” their now seen eye.
OV, Ding,ding, ding. %-)
Please don’t bring a 22 rimfire to the barricades.
@USA, With all due respect, I think that you mean Cleanliness is NEXT to Godliness. Good thoughts, though.
With no TP, it is next to impossible.
I was in the Hammond, IN Cabela’s yesterday and they had plenty of ammo and no unusual lines at the gun counter. My local Walmart in Iowa was out of .22 LR and mag this morning, though.
@Dr.S – Does Wally’s World carry 22LR? It is after all used in pistols and short barreled rifles and WW announced last year that they will no longer carry ammo for either.
WW yes on 22lr but don’t look for 9mm, some 357, 38, maybe some 40’s, and rifle is just a scale back also!!!!
Quiet! Wally World will get ideas! And yes, they do still sell 22 ammo.
I have rotated in and out of guns throughout the years but I always kept the ammo I bought. I call it trading stock. You need 357SIG or 327mag, I have some to trade. Not a lot, but something to use as currency.
Google is your friend, sometimes. Yes .327 Mag is real.
Badass round,makes a .312 bullet hit between a 9mm and 357 in power.
I understand it is a great round, but obscure enough to not be good trading material. Unless you find someone who can use it, may not find anyone willing to trade for it.
327 Federal is preferred to the 327 mag. the handgun in .327 Fed will shoot 327 fed, 327 mag and 32 S&W wwith the bonus of the 327 Fed being ballistically equal to the 357mag in equal bullet types (something pundits always neglect when making ammo comparisons). It is also superior to the 357 in accuracy due to the ballistic coefficient for matching bullet weights.
You know Rev, you really are an ignorant dumbass. Have your nuts even dropped yet?
I don’t know who he is but I know what he is. He is a project. Nothing more, nothing less.
Probably just a kid that bought his first gun yesterday and wants to impress the oldsters. He thinks that ballistic co-efficient has something to do with accuracy!!! And he says it like a fact. Obviously a rank beginner.
Something better, I hope.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f78jwFGOuV0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xnD5wjuekGQ
As I aged, hemorrhoids became an issue (too many years polishing a chair with my arse lol), and I found baby wipes to be much more suitable than TP as they clean your bum better and don’t exacerbate the problem, so I stockpiled those instead. As for .22, it was my understanding, that the major manufacturers only tool up every so often to specifically run it, as it’s kind of a pain in the patoot to make. Couple that with the uncertainty created by the 8 years of the Obutthead regime, and the recipe for Ammogeddon I was a foregone… Read more »
The truth on .22 ammo is the Ofecal face admin literally shut down the lead mining and associated production industry in the US. As .22 LR is pure lead the projos are no longer made here and are imported. Thus the .22 LR manufacturing industry is at the whim of China, the primary lead producing country in the world, as they do not have ANY environmental or health protection laws of any kind. And the manufacturing of ,22 ammo is limited to the supply of lead bullets that are exported to the US, which is also limited as lead is… Read more »
According to an article I read that’s not quite true. It said the industry gets all the lead they need from recycled batteries.
The CCI plant in Lewiston, Idaho produces 22 ammo ONLY. They don’t ‘tool up’ for anything else.
more spreading of ignorance. Lets see that patent!
How Sad, Freemasons wrote the US Constitution, and you still believe the conspiracy fools
Like parts of the world, go with left hand fingers and a water bowl. Never put the left hand into the food bowl!
@duck, Perhaps a Mexican tortilla.
@OV, Dealer’s choice.
@OV, I used to save the burning shit detail for my favorite youngsters.
Deja vu all over again! It’s almost like Obama’s back in the White House.
@JPM, Perhaps a little if you look at the negatives rather than the photos.
@OV, that is what I took him to mean. Nothing else is like the Oblabla years.
Gun sales and ammo scarcity.